My new Resing Model 65

[levallois]

Just picked it up yesterday. Overall in great shape. There is either some surface rust or cosmoline on the receiver - no pits that I can see. Parked finish looks pretty good otherwise. Stock may have been refinished but it's got it's fair share of handling marks. Perfect bore and everything functions the way it's supposed to, at least by hand. Serial 18489 - does anyone know how many of these were produced?

$376 out the door, which I thought was pretty good. Thanks for looking.


http://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/2010/10/DSC01560-1.jpg

http://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/2010/10/DSC01561-1.jpg

http://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/2010/10/DSC01563-1.jpg

[NavyEngineer]

According to Tom Batha in U.S. Martial .22RF Rifles, the first 6,000 were issued to the US Marine Corps in 1943. I've never seen a reliable estimate of how many were made. I own one as well (serial number 3721) and really enjoy shooting it - you can feel the bolt cycling inside the receiver, and it's accurate and reliable even with bulk pack ammunition. It's also the only semi-automatic .22 trainer used by US forces during World War II. I've attached a photo recently posted on rimfirecentral.com showing the Reising 65 in use.

[MK111]

According to Tom Batha in U.S. Martial .22RF Rifles, the first 6,000 were issued to the US Marine Corps in 1943. I've never seen a reliable estimate of how many were made. I own one as well (serial number 3721) and really enjoy shooting it - you can feel the bolt cycling inside the receiver, and it's accurate and reliable even with bulk pack ammunition. It's also the only semi-automatic .22 trainer used by US forces during World War II. I've attached a photo recently posted on rimfirecentral.com showing the Reising 65 in use.

I don't think it was ever established that the first 6,000 went to the USMC. Plus there are other semi-automatics used in small numbers such as the Win 74, Rem 550, Rem 241's. Little is known about these other rifles.

[NavyEngineer]

I don't think it was ever established that the first 6,000 went to the USMC. Plus there are other semi-automatics used in small numbers such as the Win 74, Rem 550, Rem 241's. Little is known about these other rifles.

MKIII, thanks for the clarification. I completely forgot about those other semi-autos. I didn't realize that the destination of the first 6,000 was in question. Have you seen another estimate of how many went to the USMC?

[emmagee1917]

...over on another forum , but the question is common.

Well , I don't have the figures in front of me , so I'm flying by the seat of my pants.
The WW2 Marine Corp was rather small , so they would not have a very great need for a ton of .22s. The M65 was made at thier request , so logic would dictate that thier contract would be filled first. It is not known where the serials began , but no one has been able to show me one with less than 4 digits , so let's assume 1001 was the first. In the '50s the Marines had more made for them , the MC58s , the serial #s started at 6,000. It would be logical that they started here , at thier request , so as not to duplicate the earlier number block.This would then mean that they purchased 5,000 , running between 1,001 and 6,000.
After the contract was filled , M65 production continued for civilian use. At the end of the war , the Marines approached H&R for a match rifle and had some changes they wanted. They built around 50 for them , and prob'ly added the improvements into the line. These improvements show up in the late 9,000 / early 10,000 range and continue till end of production. Main changes are a spring loaded beak on the action arm and a screw adjustment in the trigger group leg.
Now , this is all guess work based on the limited facts we have and the size of the WW2 Marine training facilities. I belive it to be close and true for now , but I won't be upset if the records , when/if found , prove me wrong.
Chris

Hope this helps , Chris

[emmagee1917]

...that continued production was with government approval , through the Defence Supplies Corporation. H&R would make runs of thier .22 parts as was economical , then assemble and ship after DSC would place an order , or to fill someone elses order who already had DSC approval. This was in place to produce what was needed during the war years to make the best use of materials and shop machines / labor / time. This is why production continued after the magic 6,000 number serial range. There are no records of the USMC placing another order , but it could have happened and has not been found.
Again , these are just best guesses based on limited known facts .
Chris

[NavyEngineer]

Chris,

Thanks for your thoughts. As a career Navy officer and amateur military historian, I am always interested in learning as much as I can about the history of these interesting weapons. I haven't seen any Model 65s with fewer than 4 digits serial numbers either, but I've only seen 4 in person, and not that many on the internet. Here's a picture of mine - it's finish is a little beat-up, but that is simply added character to me, and it shoots reasonably well (once you get used to the fairly heavy trigger).

[emmagee1917]

enjoy , NE.
Pics of the Reising M65 USMC (http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=14699)

Chris

[Cass]

I have never seen anything to make me think they started at any serial number other than 1. I'll attach a couple pictures of one of my H&R Mod 65's, serial number 684. I don't recall seeing a lower number but I have always assumed they are out there somewhere.

The 6,000 figure for the USMC has been around for years. I used to question the number since the features of the rifles stay constant up until around serial number 10,000. Beginning around 10000 and up into the 17-18000 range, there were some slight changes in some features.

I had theorized that the change in those features corresponded with the start of commercial sales in 1944. Recently, though, a rifle in the mid 6000 range turned up with the commercial sales paperwork. That finding made me change my thinking back to support the first 6,000 sales only being to the USMC.

The MC-58's have an interesting history too, but that is another subject.

Cass

[emmagee1917]

Thanks Cass , this is the first one I've heard of below 1,000. The first one then might have been #1. The paperwork of which you speak , is this paperwork showing a factory sale to a private party post WW2 ?
Chris

[Cass]

Chris:

I was contacted by a guy who saw a post of mine on another forum. He was helping the wife of a long time friend who had passed on deal with the rifles in his estate. One was a H&R Model 65 in the 63xx range. He recalls when his friend got the rifle when they were teenagers.

The rifle had with it the commercial sales papers that you may have seen elsewhere including the letter apologizing for the rough military finish. Unfortunately the paperwork doesn't list the serial number to make a concrete tie so it just becomes information and not proof.

Cass