Military Surplus Collectors Forums - The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum http://www.milsurps.com Forum for discussion by serious collectors of Lee Enfield arms, accessories, ammunition, and accoutrements en Fri, 20 Nov 2009 23:55:15 GMT vBulletin 60 http://www.milsurps.com/images/import/misc/rss.jpg Military Surplus Collectors Forums - The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum http://www.milsurps.com ARE YOU ON THE SQUARE? A guide to breeching up! http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17112&goto=newpost Fri, 20 Nov 2009 18:42:50 GMT ON THE SQUARE As a result of a request from forumers, I’m going to tell you how WE, the REME Armourers breeched up No4 and 5 rifles. And while... ON THE SQUARE
As a result of a request from forumers, I’m going to tell you how WE, the REME Armourers breeched up No4 and 5 rifles. And while we’re at it, this is the principle of how we did L1A1’s too.

I must stress that we were all taught the correct method of breeching up but to be honest, and I’m going to be simple now, you were relying on a parallel gauge, one end of which crossed the flat we call the KNOX FORM. And as you are well aware, while it is meant to be a datum surface and therefore accurate, in MOST cases so far as I was aware, it simply wasn’t! What I’m going to tell you ignores the relationship of the knox form with this that and the other and relies on good, sound, honest, common sense!

You have all (hopefully) read the previously published article about how we would select a barrel from a large rack of ‘em, that gave us about 18 degrees or so of underturn. If it was, say, 25 degrees, then you simply skim a gnats knacker or a RCH from the breeching up face. If it’s, say only 10 degrees, then you insert a breeching up washer to suit. Has all that stuff been read and digested?

Someone asked a couple of questions/comments about the breeching up washers after I said that we used the plentiful L1A1 washers. And simply put, the L1A1 washers are a good fit and do the job perfectly. As for the quality, well, simply put, they might not be HARD, as in mechanical engineering terms but they are TOUGH and that’s what counts in this application.

When you have breeched up your barrel so that it LOOKS pretty-well square, I want you to select a solid (as in not the fabricated type) foresight protector with straight and undamaged sides and secure it to the foresight block band When the screw it tightened up, this foresight protector should grip the block band each side. In other words, even when the screw is loosened a tad, you should not be able to rotate the protector….., not even a little bit. It must slide and sit on the foresight block band tightly.

Now you probably won’t have a hundred or so foresight protectors to try before you get one that’s perfect. You won’t need that many, and most probably, the first or second you try will do. If you can’t find one, then just make sure that before you tighten yours up, then it is sat EXACTLY equidistant/centrally astride the block band. Do you understand this. It is important.

As a matter of interest, we had an exact protector that was painted BFA yellow (that’s Blank Firing Adaptor paint colour …..) that stayed with the breeching up kit together with an extended screw with an allen-key end for ease of use but I digress…...

Now, you insert a 4” long or so .144” diameter or 9 SWG (Standard Wire Gauge) ground steel bar, through the backsight axis pin hole and rest this across two matched vee blocks that are sat on a surface plate at a height that allows the rifle to lay parallel to the surface plate or something else that is 36” or so long and absolutely FLAT. We had a sheet of plate glass that did the job as well as anything. Now, allow the foresight protectors to touch the glass. Now, gently rock the barrel and the body between the axis pin and the protectors. It SHOULD sit absolutely square, supported between the axis of the backsight axis pin and the square of the foresight protectors.

If it’s not EXACTLY square and rock free, then just tighten or undo the barrel a further gnats knacker until it is ‘no-rock’ perfect. And that is it! If we were 2nd Class Craftsmen, we’d ask a 1st class Armourer to sign off the work but to be honest, after a couple of times, it was like riding a bike

Now you have a backsight and a foresight that are both exactly upright and square to each other, regardless of what the parallel gauge or alignment lines say……….., and that’s really all that’s needed. Oh yes, and don’t talk to me about alignment bars/lines either. If you have ever breeched up Thompson guns or SA80 rifles, then you soon learn to ignore them and do it properly. If you have any fears that the extractor slot might not align with the extractor then forget it because there is ample width to cater for it.

The same idea applied to L1A1 rifles except this time, the vee block was positioned inside the body, resting on the machined inner surface. Same with No5 rifles too but this time, because we couldn’t be sure that the splayed foresight protector ‘ears’ were both splayed exactly, then a simple square was cramped to the parallel part of the upright that really needs no further explanation.

Now here’s something that you didn’t know or thought about. If you have a rifle that won’t zero until the foresight it well over to the left or right, and I’ve seen plenty of then too….., now is the time to consider whether the barrel is slightly over or under breeched. Just a slight amount will upset the balance of the foresight block………….. ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum Peter Laidler http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17112 Peter L - how to channel L42 forends? http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17110&goto=newpost Fri, 20 Nov 2009 16:55:39 GMT Peter, When you replaced L42 forends in service, did you receive pre-channelled forends from a commercial source - as for the L39 - or did you... Peter,

When you replaced L42 forends in service, did you receive pre-channelled forends from a commercial source - as for the L39 - or did you convert No4 Mk1 forends to suit?

If the latter, what method did you use to channel out the forend to receive the 7.62mm barrel? To achieve a smooth parallel channel is tricky without some sort of router or cylindrical rasp - particularly at the front where the wood ends up so thin. Most of the "civvie" gunsmith conversions I've examined seem to have been gouged out with no particular finesse or finish..... ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum Thunderbox http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17110 BSA No5 Mk1---1947 http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17083&goto=newpost Thu, 19 Nov 2009 15:58:22 GMT Paid retail for this, which is not the usual thing---but it is a 1947 dated M47C. Pre-68 import, but had a bore stuffed with grease. Some collectors... Paid retail for this, which is not the usual thing---but it is a 1947 dated M47C.
Pre-68 import, but had a bore stuffed with grease. Some collectors store them that way---so it means nothing, I suppose. Bright bore, matching numbers and overall excellant condition.
-----krinko
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]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum krinko http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17083 Afgan No.1 Mk1 found at Tulsa show http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17064&goto=newpost Thu, 19 Nov 2009 00:24:10 GMT While the socket is marked, "BSA" the lack of any inspection markings on the receiver and barrel indicate the gun was made locally in Afganistan. Note the interesting Afgan seal on the socket and knox form. It would be interesting to find out the signifigance of the "jewlery" around the stock wrist. Pieces of a mirror are fitted to the lightening cuts in the foresight protector ears.

The Marine who brought it back, inscribed his name and USMC in the brass butt plate. The butt trap is functional for an oiler but there is no hole for the pull through weight. Based on inpsection markings, the rear sight and some small parts appear to be legitimate British parts.
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]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum breakeyp http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17064 Savage stock markings help pics (1 new) http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17060&goto=newpost Wed, 18 Nov 2009 19:09:00 GMT I seem to recall somewhere in my travels reading that an "R" stamped on the furniture had the same meaning as if the "R" was stamped on a barrel, which is replacement. Can someone verify this, or was I dreaming?

I just aquired a 1942 Savage Mk1/3 that was FTR'd by Faz in 1953. The underside of the wrist has this "R" stamp along with an "F" over 53 with a few other marks. I am guessing the "F" over 53 designated the FTR.
By the way not my pics, they are the sellers, I attached the 1952 dated sling correctly:)

]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum lucky dog http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17060 Tank riders with Enfields (Pic) http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17042&goto=newpost Tue, 17 Nov 2009 23:44:03 GMT Soldiers riding a Sherman tank.
We've got Enfields, a Bren, and, uh-oh, the muzzle of an MP38 (or MP40).
Could it be someone doesn't like Enfields?
This was taken in Holland, Sept. 1944.
]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum crunch http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17042 no4 mk1 help http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17026&goto=newpost Tue, 17 Nov 2009 05:35:56 GMT hey everyone im new to this thread but i found it while looking for some answers. im hoping you fine folks can help me identify my enfield. it looks... hey everyone im new to this thread but i found it while looking for some answers. im hoping you fine folks can help me identify my enfield. it looks bad in the pics but better in real life. also any help on where is a good place to buy parts such as a sliding sight






]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum steelrain82 http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17026 what are these http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17007&goto=newpost Mon, 16 Nov 2009 12:50:41 GMT on my one and only WWI version of the smle there are two ears just above the magazine well, they are threaded, what was the purpose?? no not... on my one and only WWI version of the smle there are two ears just above the magazine well, they are threaded, what was the purpose??

no not talking about the ears for the non used stacking swivel but the ears that are next to the mag well ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum Pelago http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17007 Question for Capt Laidler, indexing No.4 barrels http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17005&goto=newpost Mon, 16 Nov 2009 10:35:38 GMT Peter How were the No.4 barrels indexed to the action??? was it something like placing a straight edge on the barrel flat and another on the... Peter

How were the No.4 barrels indexed to the action??? was it something like placing a straight edge on the barrel flat and another on the charger guide bridge??? or did it just relate to the extractor slot??

Of course it its not done accurately the foresight block wont be vertical thus necessitating a large displacement of the blade to get lateral zero.

Dave ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum whiterider http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17005 Does anyone remember this ebay listing? http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17004&goto=newpost Mon, 16 Nov 2009 07:49:41 GMT About three months ago someone in the UK advertised a group of about ten or twelve repro but unfinished scope mount components from WW1 for a P14 and... About three months ago someone in the UK advertised a group of about ten or twelve repro but unfinished scope mount components from WW1 for a P14 and or P17. The seller had two batches several weeks apart.
Anyone remember anything about them that might connect me to the seller/buyer?
I know its a long shot but we are a bit of a community, so just asking... ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum RJW NZ http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17004 Now, I know this is just a tease, enfield carbine #003 http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17003&goto=newpost Mon, 16 Nov 2009 06:48:01 GMT but I thought you'd like a look.
Enfield carbine serial number 3 on auction..
Sorry, trademe is closed to bidders except nz and aus, and items like this now fall under cultural heritage and probably won't get an export permit these days. (Actually the cultural heritage applies to all guns over 50 years old.)

serial #3 = http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/List...x?id=253915220 ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum RJW NZ http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=17003 <![CDATA[repainting my Enfield's metal parts]]> http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16981&goto=newpost Sun, 15 Nov 2009 20:47:58 GMT I have a No. 5 Mk.1 Jungle Carbine that I bought in a pawn shop for $150, and it's already "ruined" because of the three holes that were drilled and tapped in the receiver for the scope mount.



Is my understanding correct that Enfields actions & barrels were painted black? "IF" I were to get a burst of ambition and decide to try and restore it to looking like new, what should I use to repaint the steel parts with? I've never seen a rifle that was painted black before and have no idea what was used.

Just curious right now, I don't have any "plans" to do anything at the moment, but the wood is likely to be first. ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum rondog http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16981 Enfield Production Numbers (confirmation needed) http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16978&goto=newpost Sun, 15 Nov 2009 19:19:57 GMT I have come to the conclusion that :
A) The UK Police will not let me have an ‘unlimited’ number of Enfields
B) I cannot afford the aforesaid unlimited number of Enfields

Therefore my collection needs to become more focussed. I am planning to concentrate on the models that were more specialised or consisted of smaller production runs. To help me prioritise I have been investigating the production numbers of various marks / models and would welcome input as to how correct these numbers are.

Any suggestions and / or corrections welcome.

No1 MkV Trials. RSAF Enfield manufactured 20,000 rifles.

No1 MkVI Trials RSAF Enfield manufactured 1000 rifles. (1025)

No4 Trials RSAF manufactured 2500 rifles

No4Mk1T & Mk1*T. Longbranch manufactured 1000 (1588), and Holland & Holland converted 23,000 rifles.

No5 Mk1 Fazakerly and BSA combined manufacture 250,000+

No6 Mk1 Lithgow manufactured 100 rifles

No6 Mk1/1 Lithgow manufactured 100 rifles

No7Mk1 BSA manufactured 2500 rifles

Cno7Mk1 Longbranch manufactured 20,000 rifles

No8 Fazakerly manufactured 15000 and BSA manufactured 2000 rifles

No9 Parker Hale manufactured 3000 rifles.

L39A1 RSAF Enfield manufactured 1500 rifles

The last Military Enfield L42A1 RSAF Enfield manufactured 1000.

The last (Bolt Action)Enfield – Enforcer manufactured by Enfield & Parker Hale. 767 rifles.

I realise that there are numerous others, in particular that pre-date the No1 MkV trials rifles but I’ve got enough to get started with in this list.

I must admit that in view of the demand (read high prices) for a 4T I was surprised that so many were made. In comparison, the L39s, L42s and Enforcers are very under-priced. ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum Alan de Enfield http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16978 anyone ever heard this statement?? http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16977&goto=newpost Sun, 15 Nov 2009 17:39:52 GMT I have read it, and seen it, and my version may not be the most accurate, however here is the gist of it

"If you want to hunt buy a mauser, if you want to target shoot buy a springfield, if you need to go to war get a 303Brit" ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum Pelago http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16977 windage http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16976&goto=newpost Sun, 15 Nov 2009 17:36:12 GMT before these rifles were issued, did a Bn or Co armorer and/or command set windage at a known distance course, that is when the average Brit GI... before these rifles were issued, did a Bn or Co armorer and/or command set windage at a known distance course, that is when the average Brit GI issued a rifle was the windage at zero for say 200 meters?? ]]> The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum Pelago http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16976