Solvent preparation of metal prior to Suncorite?

Just a question to the REMEs, 'smiths and metalworkers here:

If you don't have access to bead-blasting, ultrasonic cleaning and other light industrial processes for cleaning metalwork (in UK you can't just leave firearms parts with your local workshop...), whats the best cleaning solvent to leave a metal surface suitable for a phosphating-type paint such as Suncorite?

Is a solvent such as methylated spirit, white spirit, kerosene, alcohol, cellulose thinners, etc suitable, or do these leave a surface residue?

I get a reasonable result by cleaning the metal with strong paint stripper, but wonder if an acid or alkali solution such as caustic soda might be better?

Was there a "field" method of ensuring good suncorite adhesion?

Wipe with a spirit based cleaner. The best is methylated spirit. It is also a good move to wipe the surface in a very thin, wish washy methlated spirit. Some that you've previously used to clean your sunkorite impregnated paint brishes is a good bet. The best surface to adhere to is light bead blasting, phosphate and paint but if you haven't got phosphate facilities, then bead blast, wipe clean with the paint brush cleaner meths which acts as its own primer. Bake, then spray then bake again

Baking is also a bit of a challenge in a domestic setting; I'll have to wait for the wife to go out to work on Monday before I see whether a No5 barrelled action will fit in the oven....

Ah, just buy an old second hand oven is the cheap way to go. Around our way, they dump them at the side of the road

Hi Thunderbox,
I've had my own homespun 'parkerizing facility' for some years. I farm out the sand blasting (mostly it's brackets & scope tubes I get done, tho' with S1 parts you just have to stay whilst they do it or get someone who is also a RFD), & once blasted they go through the PPP (Payne's Parkerizing Plant!!). This consists of a bucket of phosphoric acid/meths/water mixture in my garage, situated between the myford & the Parker Hale service vice!. Once parked I swill the acid solution off & dry by tickling with a blow lamp. My wife would inflict a long, slow & painful death upon me if I used her new oven to bake on the suncorite, so I spray it on whilst the No32 brackets are still hot. No doubt this isn't quite as good as using the oven, but it's worked pretty well for me for many years. However, remember not to heat the parts too much or the paint will denature.

Suncorite will dissolve in both meths & cellulose thinners. I think either work just as well for diluting it to spray it on, but I've definitely found meths to work best for removal. Thinners seems to turn the paint into a horrible snotty mess as it dissolves it, whereas the meths works more cleanly. Bear in mind though that even with solvents the baked on paint will take some shifting, & it may be better to just rub it down to a smooth finish with flour paper, further clean & dull the surface with meths & then try repainting. Not sure how it would work but it may be worth a try. Ideally you want to blast it all off.......

Email or PM me if I can help any further.

ATB

I found that diluting Suncorite with meths makes it dry to a glossy finish. I must try to make a barrelled action oven; maybe a piece of metal box section will do if I place it on the gas rings of the cooker...

I wonder if Fazakerley actions were dipped and then baked, or sprayed and baked in order to get that flat matt finish.

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Originally Posted by Thunderbox

I found that diluting Suncorite with meths makes it dry to a glossy finish. I must try to make a barrelled action oven; maybe a piece of metal box section will do if I place it on the gas rings of the cooker...

I wonder if Fazakerley actions were dipped and then baked, or sprayed and baked in order to get that flat matt finish.

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BBQ with an oven top. rotisserie

Excuse me Sir, what side dish would you like with that?

Thunderbox,
When you sprayed the suncorite diluted with meths, did you spray onto hot or cold metal? I generally get a matte finish on the brackets when I paint them 'warm', although rubbing oil in after makes them rather more glossy.....

Best to blast the metal surface then scrupulously degrease, and to remove any blast residue. I use Aluminum Oxide 240grit @ 60PSI. I found that a small blasting unit can be run on one of those small compressors contractors use to power their nailguns, etc. It just takes extra time vs a unit that can handle the necessary CFMs to run continuously. Without blasting, a very porous surface can be achieved with commercial-grade rust remover available at autoparts suppliers. I use this to "French Grey" metal surfaces. Essentially, the active ingredient in the product is Phosphoric Acid. Weaker solutions include commercial "liquid plumber"-type products. Check the label for this ingredient when you have to "make do." Brownell's Rust/Blueing remover is nothing more than this sort of product. Make sure that you keep the chemicals out of the bore!

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Originally Posted by muffett.2008

Excuse me Sir, what side dish would you like with that?

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Only the best. Bikkies and dip whilst warming single malt when finished.

You MUST keep sunkorite stirred thoroughly, It goes shiny when it's left and the paint starts to separate. That's why it is shelf lifed. To be honest, I know some say that you can just reconstitute it by shaking or stirring the shi........., er....... life out of it but it ain't like that! I have been told that the chemistry of it is subtle and while you can mix and shake, you've got to KEEP it mixed thoroughly. I used to watch the sprayers painting vast conveyor lines of Brens, rifles, SMG's and GPMG,s and at every break, they'd swirl the paint guns. Shiney means that the paint is separating

Has anybody experience with suncorite 528?
I got a 1liter canister and want to respray some No4 parts.
What thinner does it need and is it also to bake in an oven (what temperature?)

Frank

Methylated spirit or Denatured alcohol, (US jargon), is the best for cleaning, thinning, etc. Stirring the paint well will cut down on the initial glossy finish. Baking the paint usually does away with gloss other than what an oily rag achieves when complete.

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Originally Posted by Brian Dick

Baking the paint usually does away with gloss other than what an oily rag achieves when complete.

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How long do you need to "Bake" it and what sort of temperature is needed?

In North America, methyl hydrate is methylated spirits. Bilingualism at its best!!!
Or, good old North American gas line antifreeze. It is all methyl hydrate.
On the can it is spelled as suncorite.

400 degrees F for an hour.

Warren, I'm perplexed........... 'On the can it is spelled as suncorite'. Are you saying that Sunkorite is methyl hydrate - albeit in another form........... Surely............ or am I missing something or am I lost in the depths of chemistry?

I was doing some research the other day with the view to building my own bead blasting cabinet and came across this company Anglo Scot Abrasives they seemed to be quite good and well within the scope of a lot of the forumers on this site.

Gunsmiths and other finishers traditionally used a hot caustic bath, (sodium hydroxide) usually boiling. Some form of neutralizing hot wash to follow of course.

Easy enough to rig something up. if you want to do barrelled actions, use a large piece of pipe stood vertically if space is a problem. If you want to get clever, have a piece of say, 6 inch with a bottom welded on, then weld that inside a piece of 8 inch with no bottom obviously. Find a gas hob which has a ring that fits in the gap, add a lid to restrict heat loss from both tank and gap and 'have at 'er.'

Though the reality is that a horizontal tank is always easier to work with: how do you stabilize a vertical tank full of hot caustic after all!? (Hang it from the ceiling?)

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Originally Posted by Peter Laidler

Warren, I'm perplexed........... 'On the can it is spelled as suncorite'. Are you saying that Sunkorite is methyl hydrate - albeit in another form........... Surely............ or am I missing something or am I lost in the depths of chemistry?

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"Sunkorite" is spelt Suncorite on the Suncorite 259 can. Methyl hydrate is methyl hydrate in North America......or methylated spirits in the UK..
I was confused at your spelling of Suncorite with a K

Got you. A common language spoiled by my spelling!