COLTs 1943 with different finishes

I cannot understand why two COLTs made in the same year (one at the beginning and the other one towards the end of 1943) have got such a different finish: the earlier has got a dark grey almost shiny finish that reminds a bit of some sort of bluing (# 942,535); while the latter (# 1,121,435) is in mint conditions and has got the tipical parkerized green shade.
I mean both the pistols are totally original, but the colours of the two pistols are very different, and I don't think it's a matter of wear.
I would appreciate to know other people's opinion.

From my past experience in finishing these pistols, the strength of the solution has a great deal to do with the final coat of parkerizing it gets. A weaker solution won't leave the crystalline structure as well...and there was another thing, I think the WW2 solutions were only good for so many weapons and then had to be replaced. Not the same as today...so first in would be better than last in...

The pistol looks completely unissued and has this greenish matte shade all over also under the grips.

Given that there is 000,000's between them a small change in processes but as Jim has said first in best dressed guess as long as it planted all seven rounds (8 if you had one up the spout) into the target area that' s was all it had to do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by colt45acp

looks completely unissued

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Yes, I'm not disputing that part...just talking about the initial finishing.

Perhaps I didn't phrase properly my initial question.

Why many COLT 1911A1 have got a greenish matte shade?

Nothing to do with background colour, lighting, different cameras and so on, I'm a photographer and I already know all that, but I had already noticed long ago this greenish matte shade only on WWII COLTs (also under the grips and on internal parts) but not on REMRANDS, not on US&Ss nor on ITHACAs, :nono: so there must be a reason after all: long term storing in Cosmoline? Linseed oil? Different parkerizations? Or what else? :help:
I've got the feeling that people don't really know for sure, since I manly get people's assumptions, and different people seem to give me totally different answers.
Thanks again in anticipation.

From what we can determine, it's the mixture of the cosmoline preservative with the parkerizing over time. Also members have pointed out you can get the tinge out if you scrub the weapon with a complete de-greaser. No one seems willing to do that though. They want to keep the greenish...

Yes you're right, that green matte shade is pretty common on WWII COLT still in good shape, and it's quite nice I think.

For anyone interested, I'd like to share some of the conclusions I've come to, thanks to all the people that in these days gave me their answers/opinons on the Net, I would share it only for common knowledge:

It seems the question of what causes green parkerizing has been asked for decades in M-1 circles. I think the jury is still out. But a guy at Gunblack, a DoD supplier said, "Green tints in the coating came from poor chemistry during war-time production and elements in cosmoline and other heavy grease reacting with the coating over a long time. ...

The chromic acid contains hexavalent chromium which is nasty, nasty, nasty. It is carcinogenic, toxic and all around bad news. I do not know why it is still in the Mil Spec because the DOD also requires contractors like GunBlack to NOT use it in our process, for any components that come in to contact with human skin." Green Parkerizing... an accumulation of notes, observation and comments/various. - M40rifle.com

The parkerizing leaves a porous coating that will absorb greases and oils. Again, linseed oil may have been used
to fill the porous surface as mentioned in the following write-up from BosesGuns:
Parkerizing: Bose’s Guns offers Heavy Zinc Phosphate Parkerizing Finishes. Parkerizing, or phosphate coatings, have been used for years in various forms due to their oil trapping, non-reflective characteristics when used in severe weather conditions.

Typical Parkerizing finished color is dark gray but may vary based on the type of alloy in the steel. Color variations are achieved primarily by use of different lubricants such as Cosmoline, linseed oil, gun oil etc.
Ordnance found that the phosphate coating, which is a built up finish as opposed to coloring the metal, held oil better than the blued guns.

Scott Meadows book two has a description of the preparation of the 1911A1 pistols for shipment. The pistols were first dipped in a cleaning solution to remove fingerprints or anything that might rust the pistol. After draining they were dipped in "Oil, Lubricating, Preservative, Medium" for fifteen minutes. The oil was allowed to drain off for twenty five minutes, and the pistol was wrapped in greaseproof paper. The pistol was then packed in a box with two magazines wrapped in a single wrap of the same material. Linseed oil tends to get gummy with age, but was used on military gunstocks.

Even if a good gunsmith find the right coloration mix for a parkerizing job, dont forget that no one will be able to match a 40 years old patina. Overtime (storage, grease) can turn parkerizing to a greenish hue.

Its a long time chemical process. Some Garand experts have been able to add a chemical to the mix to accelerate that process. Apparently, it is also possible to approximate that hue by soaking a freshly black parkerized part in a high-sulfur oil, cutting oils and/or Penzoil.

That green park is sought out by people that own/buy M1 garands and 1903's. The general consensus is that its a creation of time, cosmoline, sweat and honest use. Lots of people try to recreate it but it just doesnt comeout the same. USMC 03's are often described as "Pee Yellow Park"

The last person (MB & BT) corresponded with, was a small licensed commercial re-finisher that had both a reputation for being able to achieve the 'green' color and verifiable results. He no longer accepts parkerizing jobs for that 'shade' as the chemicals are classified as 'Hazardous,' cannot be shipped and are no longer commercially available. Too bad really. While not entirely cost prohibitive, he did say that the process was 'finicky' and that re-do's were very common; but when everything went right, the results were spectacular.

From what we can determine, it's the mixture of the cosmoline preservative with the parkerizing over time.

... you can get the tinge out if you scrub the weapon with a complete de-greaser. No one seems willing to do that though. They want to keep the greenish...

From my past experience in finishing these pistols, the strength of the solution has a great deal to do with the final coat of parkerizing it gets. A weaker solution won't leave the crystalline structure as well...and there was another thing, I think the WW2 solutions were only good for so many weapons and then had to be replaced. Not the same as today...so first in would be better than last in...

... the storage method can effect the finish. Long term storage in cosmolene turned many WW2 1911's gray finish to one with a greenish tint. I once knew a gunsmith, now deceased, who could phosphate finish a 1911 and make it look exactly like the greenish one in the bottom picture...

I lean towards the chromate dip theory. A final step in Parkerizing is a dip in a chromate solution to add corrosion resistance. Many chromate compounds are green in solution. Maybe Colt used one of those, the others used a different mix.

I have no answer for this ongoing dilemma we all have but want to add this. In well over 35 years collecting military rifles I find it interesting that many, MANY of the Remington 03s , 03A3s and 03A4s I have owned, encountered, handled (etc), they do tend to have the "greenish" hue to them. I don't ever remember seeing ANY Smith Coronas with green,, and only some SAs with green. As for Rock Island, I just don't remember..

Hope this will be interesting to many of us.

Regards.