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    Member garthok's Avatar
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    Bren semi auto build - USA

    I recently purchased an MGS WWII Bren 1 Parts Kit as a project My dad and I could work on. I have most of the mechanical questions worked out, but before I begin any of the welding on the demilled receiver I would like advice on what kind of ATF form(s) may need to be filled out. Do I need to submit a request to manufacture a receiver and the $200 tax? Some forums I looked at implied that it wasn't required unless you plan on selling the final product. Can someone who has made a welded receiver advise me on how you handled it?

    Once I have this question answered I will document the project as it progresses.


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    Really Senior Member Midmichigun's Avatar
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    Gart,
    I have two MGS Bren kits.... through a Weaponeer group buy, I got the semi auto conversion parts kit for one of them.

    Left to do is the blocking of the receiver and the welding like you mention.

    You do NOT need to file ATF paperwork to make your own rifle. A semi auto design is allowable....

    The $200 tax you are referring to, is based on a transfer of a NFA weapon I believe. As you probably know, post 1986 manufacture of a machine gun is prohibited by the general public. New manufacture machine guns are only as post 86 dealer samples transferable to other dealers / manufacturers and law enforcement.

    I would stick to a proven Semi Auto design, and insure that it is engraved somewhere that it is Semi Auto only and has a legible serial number. This is to keep you outta trouble if you are stopped and asked about it.

    I know that some folks keep the ATF letter of the proven Semi Auto design with their rifles, just in case they are questioned.

    The big pearl of wisdom to share, is to convert as much of the rifle as possible to the semi auto (bolts and FCG's)... and weld in a blocking bar, before welding up the original receiver. As you may know, the torch or cut pcs are just interesting items until you start fabing... then they could become "intent" to manufacture.

    As to selling the semi auto rifle..... it is permissable to sell your own manufactured rifle. However, it is a grey area due to the fact that you don't have a manufacturing license... I would intend to keep the rifle after you finish it, if I were you. Besides, that rifle would have questionable value, onless you are a recognized individual or corporation building such devices.

    If you are doing a novel Semi- Auto build, then you may want to submit that design for proving, to the ATF. This would be a prudent measure.

    These are just my opinions, and I am sure others will chime in. It is always best to follow up with your research, since I may be in error, and don't have a law license, and am not an expert in regulations governing all ATF and local/ state regs.

    I look forward to your build! Ask if you have further questions!!

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    Member garthok's Avatar
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    Thanks!
    The ATF website has a form: ATF F 5320.1 (Form 1) — Application to make and Register a Firearm. That caused the confusion, apparently it is legal to make a firearm and not register it. I will be calling the ATF for a quick confirm, and then get it in writing.

    I will be using the semi parts kit from MGS and plan on duplicating their effort with the FA parts that came with the bren kit to make a complete second set of SA parts. (that may or may not turn out too well).

    I will be manufacturing my own welding jig as I cannot find one for less than $125. The measurements for how everything fits can be done using the internal components and magazine as guides. Remembering to allow for shrinkage. The Jig will be a stack of sheet metal tack welded together then machined to add copper plates behind the weld areas. Unless it costs more than $125 to do it that way.

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    Really Senior Member Midmichigun's Avatar
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    Gart,
    Sounds like we have common effort/ purpose. I am planning on fabing up a second set of SA parts for my second build also... I believe the SA parts kit was sourced through Weaponeer, and is indeed the MGS.
    I agree on the jig also. I have kept my eyes peeled, but it always comes down to $$. I was hoping to come across a nice BREN print to create the jig, so I don't have to reason out critical dimenions.....
    To take into your account for shrinkage, remember to put in splices (virgin metal or donor torch cut). When I get a chance, I will link you to a website where the guy took the torched parts and milled them, and inset an exactly spaced pc. This controlled his contraction upon cooling. Some fella's go with 8620 steel, others 1045.

    I have access to MIG, stick and gas. TIG is the preferred method for rewelding....

    I know of several gunsmiths who have been cautioned by the ATF to report rifles that come in without serial numbers. As a matter of fact, one such rifle appeared during an ATF inspection at the gunsmiths. The ATF did follow up with the owner on where he got the rifle. Hence my cautioning of insuring that you have a legible SN on your manufacture.

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    Member garthok's Avatar
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    You are probably referring to: Bren
    Also found limited blueprints on Bren blueprints...

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    this is one im going to follow post lots of pic's eh

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    Hey Garthok I've just had a look at your BREN suggestion (post 5). It's amazing........ I wouldn't have believed it to be as possible and as good if I hadn't seen it myself. It's not just the good machine shop and welding facilities but the multi-skills of the fellow too. Great pictorial essay. Do you know him or did you just pick it up?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Laidlericon View Post
    Hey Garthok I've just had a look at your BREN suggestion (post 5). It's amazing........ I wouldn't have believed it to be as possible and as good if I hadn't seen it myself. It's not just the good machine shop and welding facilities but the multi-skills of the fellow too. Great pictorial essay. Do you know him or did you just pick it up?
    I just found that site while googling bren kits, it was that site that has inspired me to try this project. He does make it look easier than it probably is.

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    you are teasing us canucks with this one though we have to get a new receiver machined and that in it self would cost quite a bit not to mention if your design is not approved your receiver gets choped not a big deal with something like a sten but a real big deal with a bren

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    I hate to say it, but I think I bought the last semi auto parts kit from MGS. They removed it from their online store just after I bought it. After several hours of grinding slag, everything "fits". I am torn between paying somebody to do the welding or learning to weld on my own. Both can be expensive. I have ordered the gas selector and a magazine, and MGS is sending me the missing barrel bolt. Anyway here it is roughly assembled:

    Last edited by garthok; 05-18-2012 at 09:06 AM.

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