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  1. #1
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    An Interesting little Carbine

    I think this BSA "volunteer" carbine started life as a charger loader rifle as the volly sight screw holes are still in the butt socket. It is undated but otherwise well marked and all matching including the sight ladder, it has a windage adjustable rearsight and is in overall very good condition for its age, the bore is excellent, bright with good rifiling. I assume (never a wise thing to do) that this was probably made for an officer as I can't find any reference to this carbine in any of the books I have. Although it is fitted with a bayonet nose cap the standard "Long Lee" bayonet does not fit as the barrel at this point is to big, but then what officer would use a bayonet when you can assult the enemy with a swagger stick and a pistol in hand!!!!
    Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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    Last edited by Buccaneer; 04-14-2014 at 05:18 PM.

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    My thoughts are that it was used as a range rifle. The holes on the wrist is where the peep sight attached to the rifle

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    Nice old thing with a handsome bit of wood on it. What does "GG16" stand for?

    Is this as far as the bolt will close?

    Last edited by Surpmil; 04-15-2014 at 01:38 AM.
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    Legacy Member Bruce_in_Oz's Avatar
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    Looks like somebody's attempt at a "home-brew" R.I.C. carbine.

    "Fish-belly mag looks to be "commercial / sporter" type, common on BSA, etc. "sporters" of the early 20th Century..
    Sights are a bit odd.
    LM, LE and RIC carbines don't have a charger guide.
    RIC's have litle "extra" collar at the muzzle to build up the LEC barrel diameter to support the P-88 bayonet.
    If this barrel is too FAT to take the '88, it would have to be made from a rifle barrel of Metford / Enfield spec.
    If it were "factory-made" as a carbine, the bolt "knob' would be flattened and the handle swept forward.

    Not enough visible markings to go any further.

    It's ringing a bell, but I think it's an alarm bell.

    If you could get if for beer money, it might be an interesting conversation piece of a good source of parts.

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    I think Buccaneer is right - it is based on a BSA territorial service pattern CCLE that has been shortened to a 19" barrel and had the nose cap, foresight, magazine butt and slightly shortened fore end from a trade pattern carbine fitted.
    According to my measurements the muzzle would be about 117mm as opposed to the normal diameter of about 16.5mm for the 1888 bayonet.
    Still quite a nice rifle all made from commercial BSA parts.

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    A very good friend found this information in an old BSA catalogue unfortunately not dated but would seem to be early 1900's. It would appear that the charger guide was an optional extra!!
    This information seems to answer all the questions, we should remember that not all Enfield Riflesicon were made specifically for the military and as such should not be dismissed out of hand just because they don't appear to conform to the recognised military spec as Peter has said many times "never say never" when it comes to Enfield rifles.

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    Is it a No.3 Trade pattern then? Who would have bought these? Serving Officers as a private purchase for Service use or maybe Serving officers wanting a more sporty looking rifle for game shooting in the Commonwealth (but still using freely available .303 ammo thanks to HRH Queen Vicky).

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    Legacy Member Bruce_in_Oz's Avatar
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    Note the 7mm and 8mm "options" in the catalogue list.

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    The No1 and No2 Carbines on the catalogue page are stated to have 19" barrels as does this one (?), so this may well be a commercial job, but which company?

    If the woodwork was done later it should be obvious when the rifle is unstocked and the nose cap removed.
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    Legacy Member Bruce_in_Oz's Avatar
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    There was once a retail outlet in Britainicon called, I think, "The Army and Navy Store".

    This was a retail chain that supplied all manner of "after-market" goodies to better-heeled members of the services (It somewhat predated the RAF).

    I have seen several Lee-Enfield based sporting rifles with their "house brand" on them. Among them were some lovely little carbines with spectacular timber and fancy engraved actions, barrel ribs, multi-leaf express sights etc.

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