Pre dip black parkerizing post dip black dye parkerizing.

[Topfmine]

Thanks for all the info very useful, In the next couple of months I will do some experimenting hopefully with some interesting results.

[Topfmine]

I don't know what's all in Brownells surface activation solution.

Look for something containing titanium salt or salts, or Jernstedt salts. It's probably potassium titanium fluoride (dipotassium hexafluorotitanate). It might also be listed as a grain refiner.


[edit]

Here you go. They ship to the UK. Look for Great Britain in the drop down when you checkout.

Manufacturer of DuraCoat Firearm Finishes: Black Dip Parkerizing Pre-Treatment

I would have bought some pre dip black solution but at over $100 odd dollars for shipping just a quart of solution it looks like I will have to look else where. Anyone know if I can get it in Europe.

[Vincent]

Try Henkel.

[edit]

Fixodine M is another name for BONDERITE M-AC M. It's for manganese phosphating.

Henkel also sells several Fixodine products for zinc phosphating. Look under Surface Treatment Conditioners. http://www.bdi-usa.com/FileUploads/CMSFiles/Surface%20Treatment[0].pdf

[Topfmine]

Well I contacted about 15 companies here in the UK and not one reply. Fantastic looking web pages but it's like dealing with Neanderthal man who just discovered a jet aircraft. Looks like I will have to save up on the postage or find another European country that would stock more Brownells or Midway products than Brownells UK that hardly stocks anything like Brownells USA. Any suggestions to get my hands on this pre dip solution?

PS, much appreciated Vincent for your help.

[Vincent]

I did some digging. It looks like the DuraCoat Black Dip is just an acid bath, a mixture containing Sulfuric, Phosphoric and Hydrochloric acids. There are no Jernstedt salts listed.

[Topfmine]

I had a look at Brownells MSDS sheet and found that Hydrogen chloride and Potassium Antimony Tartrate is used in the mix, not sure how the chemical reaction takes place or what its meant to do or how toxic it is, anyone know or if there are other ways. I was reading that the Black phosphate process is the most overlooked functional metal finish process around today. I had a chat to a Canadian company and they are looking for an agent to set up in Europe that sells the black phosphate process etc., anyone interested I can pass on details.

[Topfmine]

Has any members on this forum used this pre dip black, just wondered what you think of it and the finish. I have had finishers this side of the pond say its just a fad someone has managed to create a bit of a niche that really isn’t there!

[Vincent]

I am confused. Are you doing Zinc or Manganese phosphating?

[Topfmine]

I have both zinc and manganese. The pre black solution seems to be used for the zinc process.

[Vincent]

You might give ILVE Chemical in Istanbul a call. See if they will send you a small test sample.