"Flanders Flap"

[Buccaneer]

Yet another "Flanders Flap" has appeared on ebay for the same seller as the previous ones. I sent a question asking him (or her) to confirm if he thought the item was original or a repro item as the description does indicate one way or the other, needless to say I have not had a reply nor has my question been registered under the "questions asked section".
I know that it is a repro item, it just bugs me that yet again the unwary could be caught out by a less than honest description.

WW1 British Brandauer CO THE LEE Enfield Smle MUD Flap | eBay

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[Gingercat]

The first one that was listed had me going for a moment, but then several more appeared at regular intervals. 'Used condition' is not a very honest description if it's patently a repro made to look used.

[Roger Payne]

If it's the one I've seen then you can tell it's a repro quite easily (no matter how well aged it is) simply because no company would have hand stamped their name or logo onto the thing in the way that this one is marked. The lettering isn't even in a straight line. Even a hundred years ago the name or logo would have been rolled on all in one action.

[Flying10uk]

A few months back there was a No4 pig-sticker bayonet for sale on a well known auction site that some-one was selling as a Mk1 but was made from a Mk2*. It was so bad it was almost laughable.

[skiprat]

These reproduction flaps are been sold as reproductions by 2 dealers here in the UK
The only markings on them is the government arrow stamped on the front ( where the original makers mark was)!
Look closely at the point where the spring is fitted. Both fixing points are very different from the original!!
All the measurements are metric!!!
The spring is still springy, and not a lump of very thin iron oxide!!!!

[Badger]

For those newer collectors who may want more detail, check the MKL under this entry in the United Kingdom section......

1917 No.1 MkIII* Rifle (137 picture virtual tour ... click here)

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The rifle shown in the virtual tour is correctly serial number matched and in addition, is equipped with a very rare Flanders Flap. This flap was designed to keep the mud out of the barrel, but was spring mounted so it could easily be opened, or flip out of the way if the soldier accidentally discharged his rifle without opening it.


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Regards,
Doug

[Seaspriter]

To sell a counterfeit item that is not properly represented is fraud.

While many of us complain about ebay, they are not the evil empire.

I suggest you insist the seller either: 1) certify it is reproduction or 2) certify that it is an original.

If he can't certify the item is an "original," then it must be sold as a "used reproduction."

If the seller is uncooperative, you should contact ebay with a complaint. You would be amazed what happens when a seller gets a ding from ebay -- it really stings. I know because I bought something that was not properly advertised, sent it back, and when the seller complained, I was less than kind with my feedback. This was picked up immediately by ebay, who put penalties against the seller, who in turn begged me to change my feedback and even offered a veiled bribe in the form of discounts on future purchases (which I refused).

[Peter Laidler]

Skippy has effectively told the whole world what to look for. What better can anyone ask?

[Colonel Enfield]

I read somewhere the easiest way to spot an original Flanders Flap (also known as a "Mousetrap") was to look for the hole through it caused when the soldier inevitably fired his rifle without opening the flap first.

[mrclark303]

Attachment 66380Attachment 66381Attachment 66382Here's my example, more handy reference images to compare with the original item above.

When I phoned up the large UK dealer in question to enquire about them I was told that they came in with "a lot of old Enfield stuff" , I was also told (chap going into full car salesman mode by this point)

that they are real, but are of post WW1 manufacture! When I pointed out that they were declared obsolete with the wars end, so who made them and why ..... he just went very quiet.

... I would guess they are mid 1990's Indian manufacture, so definitely post WW1!

Anyway, at £49, they are very clearly not the real deal, price alone confirms this, but that said, not a bad reproduction of the original at all and a very good talking point on the range!

Quite happy with mine and it will do until an original can take its place on my rifle.