Carcano Model 1891 Vs. Model 1891/41, How to spot differences in them
Next week, I am looking at what is suppose to be a Carcano Model 1891 Rifle that was made in 1918. Can you look at the rifle and verify it is in fact a Model 1891, Let me know a approximate value range and I'd like to know the differences in a Model 1891 and a Model 1891/41. I thought the 1891 Carcano's had Straight Bolts, This one has a Turned Down Bolt is one thing I'm not sure about.
Thank You... as you can tell, I am new to all this.
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That is an 1891. They have the modified Vetterli M70 type rear sight. The 1941 has the carbine type rear sight.
Around here $400 is the absolute top dollar. $325 is probably close to average. I don’t see a cleaning rod in those pictures. 1941’s tend to have very nice bores. A lot of 1891’s have worn bores. Also make sure it’s still chambered for 6.5x52mm. Some were rechambered in 6.5x54mm Mannlicher Schönauer.
I have a 1941 with a straight bolt handle and I have one that has a turned down bolt. No idea why some are turned down.
Both the M91 Infantry Rifle and M41 (also called the M91/41) should have a straight bolt handle. If they don't they are either from other Carcanos (M91TS, M91 Carbines etc.) or have been bent down.
Differences between the M91 and M41 are
M91 is longer than a M41,
M91 has a longer rear sight, well the M41 has a rear sight like the carbines
M91 has the almost hexagonal barrel shank, well the M41s is round
M91 was only produced from 1891 to 1918 with a short small number production run from 1932-1941 (by two different arsenals)
M41 was produced from 1941-1944
M41s also don't have the gain twist rifling a M91 has.
1891 rifles should have straight bolts. If it has a turned down bolt, it's from a carbine. They are interchangeable, but if you want it to be correct, you'll probably need to swap it out. Cleaning rods are a nightmare, figure $50 minimum if you can find one and that isn't very likely. They have the threads near the top as it screws into the front of the rifle, not at the end of the rod like most.
Check for a Turbata stamp on the receiver or barrel. This indicates the barrel was re-sleeved at some point, a lot of the early ones were. Not a huge problem but not as desirable as an original.
A good one with all it's parts and cleaning rod can be $400 easy but you should deduct from there whatever is missing and a bit more if Turbata.
From your photos, it looks to be in pretty nice shape, good bluing on the metal and the stock doesn't look abused at all. Bolt is in the white which is fine but again, it should be a straight bolt.
"Turbata" ??? I didn't know Carcanos were "Troubled"...Tubata (Tubed) is the marking for Relined M91s before and during WW I. After WW I a lot of M91s were used as "Parts Guns" for building M91/24 TS, M91/28 TS, and even M1938 FC (7,35mm)
Doc AV...Yes, maybe the Carcano series did have a "perturbed" Life....
---------- Post added at 09:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:44 PM ----------
NO need to; The Carcano system allowed for all bolts to interchange with all Rifles..."Headspace" is a Malaise typical of American shooters.
The Tubata barrels are primarily found on early Carcanos. The first propellent they used for there ammo had such a high erosion rate the barrels would wear out in no time, hence relining them (they also did something similar for there Vetterli Carcano, though that was done to make those rifles 6.5 Carcano from there larger diameter black powder loadings). As time progressed the Italians found a better smokeless powder and that was no longer a issue (hense why you don't see it on later rifles).
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