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I finally have gotten all the grease out of a laminated stock I recently purchased. I understand the Germans applied no finish to the laminated stocks but they all seem to have a nice "golden" color to them. My stock looks washed out now. How can I restore the golden color? Thanks.
The stocks left the factory white. I understand the troops used axel grease to color the wood. Red tinted grease gave them the golden color.
The laminates are about 1/16" thick. Grain all runs in same direction. The "glue" used is a phonalic resin which will not absorb oil, stain or water. So only the top layer of wood and exposed end grain will do so. I have never read anything about German troops putting anything on these stocks to "color them, I think this is just hearsay. However, like soldiers everywhere, they may have. I do believe that the "golden color" you mention is more the natural color of the wood as it ages and is handled. All wood gets darker exposed to light. After washing one of these stocks I put one or two coats of BLO, which will get your golden color. Do not apply too much, so it gets shiney, thin coats and rub in well. SMOOTH WELL with 00 steel wool first. (avoid stampings)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bert
Actually, that's not true. For most of the war the laminated stocks were stained and a finish was applied. The exact nature of the finish isn't known but it was probably linseed oil based. The German soldier's manual "Der Rekrut" specified "linseed-oil varnish" for stock maintenance Care of Weapons / der Erste ZugQuote:
Originally Posted by Calif-Steve
It was only near the end of the war that the stain and finish fell out of use, as the overall fit and finish of the stocks declined. "Chatter marks" on the stocks from worn out tooling were left unsanded and are frequently found on late war stocks.
"Golden" or blonde Kar98k stocks in period pictures are very rare.
Here is a selection of unrestored, un-messed with rifles to give a sense of what the stocks should look like. These pictures are from the picture sticky thread at gunboards.com Picture Threads - Links - Gunboard's Forums
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...dar20all-1.jpg
http://wccsptnc.com/images/IMG_2869.JPG
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...43rtside-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...SANY0183-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...P1000371-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSCN6572-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSCN0066-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSCF0001-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC_0244-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC_0231-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...07/bnz43-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...07/ax010-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...b_all20r-1.jpg
Now, were there some golden blonde stocks? Yes, but they were rare. The top rifle is a dou. 43, the bottom is a dou.44. The color of the top rifle stock is far more typical of a Kar98k.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...nd44allr-1.jpg
We will have to "agree to disagree". I have 2 1938 matched rifles which are as blond as your last picture. The # 8655k pictured looks like an RC with that red color. Any of these stocks that are "stained" were done by GI's who brought them home. The rifle on the table is too shiney to be original. The first three in first picture do look 'typical' but it is from use, oil applied by troops,and just plain exposure. The manual you qoute says 'maintenance', nothing about factory finish. All referances I have read say they were not finished at the factory, if it is mentioned at all.
As I stated earlier, there were some blonde stocks, they just weren't common or typical. And there is no way to know if your blonde stocks were originally blonde or were refinished after the war. I would be very interested in seeing pictures of your rifles, if you would be kind enough to post them. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
Nope. Not RC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...7/bnz436-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...07/bnz43-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...7/bnz431-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...7/bnz439-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...7/bnz438-1.jpg
bnz43 war horse - Gunboard's Forums
That's a pretty wild theory. So all of these rifles found all over the place have similar coloring because all of them were stained (through the finish) by GI's who brought them home? And all of these GIs apparently used the same stain? Any evidence to support your theory?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
The shiny appearance is from using flash photography indoors. You can see more pictures at Matching 660 1940 - Gunboard's Forums
That's right, but there is also no mention of "axle grease" or "diesel oil" or any of the other things that people claim the Wehrmacht slathered all over these stocks. :lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
I would love to see the references you are referring to. The most widely known reference, "Backbone of the Wehrmacht" by Law says the stocks were finished but he didn't go into details because the exact finish isn't known.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave
The pictures I posted are just a small sample of the many pictures of original rifles listed in this thread --> Picture Threads - Links - Gunboard's Forums
I recommend that people go through the pictures in those threads and come to their own conclusions. :);)
Notice the tone/darkness of the stocks in these pictures (taken before any GIs would have had a chance to stain them :)):
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...erpg1801-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...09/07/11-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...044047PM-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../07/Bayo-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ningK984-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo..._wss_423-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...clearing-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...4_08_019-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...311512_G-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...6041726_-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...9086912A-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...77dr6mc5-1.jpg
Sorry I am not set up to do pictures or I would be glad to do so. All most all (the 2-38's included) were purchased during the 1950's at various gun shops for 30-40 bucks, before any mass imports. One of the 38's has a duffle cut and I believe they are bring backs, however it can't be proven, of course. All that has been done to the stocks is a hot soap water bath. Now many of the stocks are still as you picture, darker in color. A very few had a stain applied. the stained ones covered many makers and years. The bath did not remove the stain or the oil soaked darker color on these. Over the period mentioned I purchased probably 40 K98's so my experiance is not just with the ones I now have left. One even had a duffle cut with a walnut forepiece and laminate stock! The guy I got it from said he and 4-5 buddies all cut and shipped their rifles to-gether using 75 m/m ammo tubes. (so much for duffle bags) Parts got mixed, reason I think for allot of mis-matched bolts. But thats another topic!
Over in another forum someone posted a picture of two bringback rifles I was going to buy a Mitchell's Mauser, but not now. - Gunboard's Forums
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...thepair1-1.jpg
If you look at the stock bolt cutout on the blonde one, it has rounded edges, suggesting that it had been sanded some time after it left the factory. As you said, these rifles used to be cheap and many were sporterized, stocks sanded and refinished, etc.
And again, there were a few blonde stocks, but they were rare. If you look carefully at this picture I posted earlier
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ningK984-1.jpg
the rifle farthest from the camera has a lighter color stock than the others. Again, golden blonde stocks were the exception, not the rule. Most of them were orangish-brown originally.
"Backbone of the Wehrmacht" by Richard Law says the stocks were "stained and polished" from 1934 through 1943. Beginning in 1944 it says stocks were "polished and unpolished; stained and unstained" or "polished, stained and unstained".
At the end of the war the Kreigsmodell stocks appeared. These were simplified stocks with no bayonet lug, no cleaning rod channel, no routing for a band spring, and no bolt takedown disk. According to Law: "Kreigsmodell stocks are very rough and unfinished; neither sanded smooth nor stained and sealed."
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../kriegs1-1.jpg
Excepting Kreigsmodell stocks, the vast majority of K98 stocks were sanded, stained, and finished, resulting in the appearance seen in the photos I posted earlier.
My theory for the reason so many people think the majority of K98 stocks were "golden" in color is because most have seen either stripped Russian Capture stocks that were heavily sanded by the Soviets before they were shellaced, Norwegian surrender/capture stocks sold on ebay that the Norwegians had refinished with a golden yellow finish, or, most likely, the ubiquitous Mitchell's Mauser ads that are in every gun magazine, featuring a picture of one of their rifles with a heavily sanded "golden" blonde stock:
http://mauser.org/rifles/K98k%20German/K98-Right.gif
But everyone knows Mitchell's Mausers are not a good reference for authenticity. :)