LEE DIES 7.62x54r

Well just started using these Lee dies for the first time. Somewhat confused on a part of it all.


I bought the die set, got the additional .303 british expander stem and installed it before use.

A fired case lets a speer 150 grain TMJ .308 bullet linked here

Speer Ammo - TMJ Rifle Bullet - 308150TMJ

slide in, no resistance, no tensions to hold it. it has an easily seen gap between bullet and case mouth.

After running my empty cases through the die, the bullet DOES NOT fit into the case mouth. It behaves like it does with a fully resized .308 Winchester case.

Is this correct bullet fitment after the case goes through a .303 enfield expander rod made for .310-.311 bullets.

I DO plan on using this bullet with the 8 grains of Bulls Eye gallery/guard load by Harris.

Are you sure that the expander is the correct size???

it came in the right package

The 7.62 x 54R is a veritable antique, but it has outlasted everything else from that era in actual front-line service around the globe. (PK/PKM, SVD "Dragunov"and "clones", for starters)

The first Mosin Nagant rifles were called the "Three Line" rifle. A "Line" is an old, Imperial Russian unit of measure which is essentially a tenth of an inch. Thus, "three Lines" is .300"; "Thirty cal".

Where it gets interesting is that the GROOVE diameter is defines as a DEPTH from that .300" bore. This is EXACTLY the same procedure as was used in the British ,303" system.

Most of the bullets seem to measure out at .311" / .312", but like the .303, the functional groove diameter is often a few thou. larger.

This is a hangover from the days of the Minie Ball, which was made to fit closely to, but past the rifling lands in the barrel. A hefty black-powder kick up the backside expanded the rear "skirt' of the "ball" into the grooves. This sealed the system somewhat, thus minimizing gas blow-by. The expanded skirt, riding in the grooves, was what made the bullet spin. The expanded skirt also helped to "sweep" out some of the fouling from the previous shot (s). Accuracy and downrange ballistics were also enhanced, as can be seen in the butcher's bills of the US Civil War, Crimea, etc.

All early breech-loaders used un-jacketed lead bullets, some solid but many of the skirted Minie / Enfield style. In the grimy old days of Black Powder, a bullet that was a bit "loose" enabled more rounds down-range before the whole system sludged up and a serious cleaning was in order. Note that Martini Henry bullets are not "hollow-based" / "skirted", but TAPERED. This means that the front end of the bullet rides the lands, but the taper eases the bullet into the complex Henry rifling. Like the .577 Sniders and Pattern 53 Enfields before them, MH rifles with the CORRECT bullet, paper-patched, of course, will produce some surprisingly small groups at many hundreds of yards.

Jacketed bullets with open bases DO exhibit some expansion on firing, especially at the base. This is best produced by a "short, sharp shock" as delivered by smokeless propellants.

The Swiss noticed this and changed both their rifling and AMMO to take the greatest advantage of this knowledge. The leap from GP-90 (1889) to GP-11 ammunition is immense.

The Finns use a special version of the cartridge called the 7.62 x 53R. SAME case, but precision-made HP Match bullets, (.308" diameter), specifically as a sniper / match round. The rifles will safely digest stock-standard 7.62 x 54R Ball in an "emergency". What's a couple of thousandths of an inch in a well-built Mosin Nagant action?

If your bullets are just dropping into the sized necks, something is amiss. Check your expander "ball" on the decapping stem. The "proper" expander should be approx. three to five thou bigger than that for .308" bullets. One useful thing I discovered some time back is expanders made from Tungsten Carbide. No drag, no "squeal", no LUBE!! Lee and others sell them as kits with a couple of different adapter nuts to suit a wide range of "other people's" dies. Highly recommended pieces of kit.

Supplementary:

The "new" bullet is meant to be a tight fit in the neck, and, friction between the case and bullet is about all that holds the bullet in place. Most factory ammo works on the same principle. Neck crimping is a whole different extra process and has been discussed around here on a couple of occasions.

If you size the cases but use a very undersized expander (or no expander at all), there may be "issues". "Flat-based' bullets will be extremely difficult to seat and there is a high likelihood that as the bullet is forced into an undersized neck, the neck will buckle. Alternately, if it starts to seat, causing the neck to expand, that expansion will NOT be concentric with the rest of the case, and thus, not concentric with the chamber. The round will still fire and the brass will expand to seal the chamber, but a case that is "eccentric" in the chamber will expand eccentrically when fired. Sizing it back, more or less concentrically, will work the brass more than usual, thus reducing its reloading life.

Finally:

If you feel the need to use a lube on the (non-carbide) expander, make sure that lube is cleaned off before final filling, otherwise that desired neck friction will be compromised. Not only that, but residual "wet" lube inside the neck will cause powder granules to adhere to the inside of the neck and interfere with the powder-filling operation, not to forget, actually contaminate the propellant. Residual graphite or similar dry neck lube just reduce the neck friction.

Because the brass "flows" during sizing AND expansion, keep a close watch on overall length; trim as needed.

A light inside chamfer cut into the mouth of the case will remove burrs from trimming and act as a "funnel' during bullet seating.

It probably all sounds a bit fiddly, but the details count and will make the overall reloading caper and the results on the range more satisfying.