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The early Enforcers with the oval milled area do appear to include a number of re-marked Envoys. If anyone ever got around to compiling a list of Envoy numbers, they'd probably find that there were a hundred or so numbers "missing".
Incidentally, Envoys are probably an even rarer rifle than an Enforcer. Not sure what the highest Envoy number is, but I haven't come across one over about 450.
498 is out there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbox
525 is the highest Envoy number, All made in 1969, 526 appeared in a Skennerton book, that rifle was made in 1981 or 1982 from memory!
So why isn't 526 the highest number?
Odd that they would even be set up to do a one-off a decade later.
Are you saying something between the lines I've missed?
It's a case of nobody knows I think! 526 might of been a "one off" for a trial or something!
Re AdeE's thread (10, page 1) it seems incredible beyond belief that Enfield should have encountered problems finding Enfield No4 actions to convert into Enforcers. Just the quantity of 767 over that period is a mere drop in the ocean given the vast, almost unbelieveable quantity that were blocking up UK Ordnance depots across the world. At the time, No4's were being back loaded wholesale.........
I realise that a Govt Ordnance factory isn't the MoD but BOTH are wholly owned and controlled by the Government and if the Govt tells the Home Office that the Police WILL have these rifles then the spokes on the wheel all ring together, believe me.
Is it also correct that the rifles went from Enfield to P-H to be fitted with the telescope? Or did they go to the Police Forces who then sent them out to be fitted with any of the approved fittings. I ask because Enfield were not happy that some rifles came back with small bulges in the chambers where the clowns fitting the breech-ring pad went into the barrel, down and almost into the chamber. All very well - until the pressure in the case and chamber exceeded the elasticity of the steel - and it bulged! And I don't for one minute believe that P-H would have done that and nor would Enfield...........
Maybe Gil can ask his P-H contacts about their part in this.........
My investigations show that Enfield supplied the 7.62 barreled action to Parker Hale, who then fitted the furniture (bought from Colin Moon & Sile of Italy), the PH5E/4 rear sight, the FS22 front sight and the scope mounts. I cannot find out if PH or Enfield then fitted the Pecar Scope - but PH certainly supplied and fitted the mounts and supplied (if not mounted) the rings.
It has been suggested by 'others' that in fact Enfield fitted the furniture themselves.
The rifles were shipped from Enfield to the various Police Forces, so somehow, and at some stage of completion the rifles left PH and arrived at Enfield
Well,
I can perhaps help a little not a lot.
Colin Moon who I thought was in Brighton, was where I ordered my wooden sculpted butt and stock from. This was an option if, like me, I always seemed to be the one in the open when it was hissing down and preferred a non slip surface for my left grip and glove.
Could be wrong but thats the guy I believe did wonderous things for every single Police Force who all in turn asked for "special" adaptions.
Coming onto Peter's point, Parker Hale did supply the 20 and 21 mounts to a lot of Forces.
The 20 was a block that was drilled and tapped to the front reciever but nowhere near any barrels causing them to bulge. They then often not always supplied a Parker Hale 1" high mount and often, but not always, flattened the wood to fit customer specified telecsopes
The 21 mount was merely added to replace the battle sight on the back end.
I have to say at this stage, and I apologise for repeating myself, Police shooters were "marksmen" not snipers. They were invariably ex Army trained full coursed snipers, who had a skill to offer the Police in those early days of Firearms Units starting up in most Forces, which incidentally coincided with the release of a new Home Office approved "Sniper" rifle.
Their words not anybody else's.
If I was honest, those days were the best.......men leaving the services after the war and doing 30 years with a lot of experience and those added to them who were trained also in later Army days up until the early eighties.
Then things changed big time and I quite frankly didn't rate any of them as decent shots! IMHO.
So in short, lots of requests all over the place for lots of differing bits and pieces and what a mess, instead of someone in authority saying you have ordered these and they come with this scope and fitting as standard.
I for one hope the price does keep going up. At least by CPI otherwise over time they will get junked as having no value. Just think granddad passes kids have no interest call in skip bin clean out house all gone. Have seen it with a large collection, a bulldozer large hole all gone.Quote:
Originally Posted by desperatedan
Bindi,
I have my compass and airline ticket........now where was that hole???:)