another one, can't make out the serial #on rifle but has scope # 90L8162 scope 170-C
Lee Enfield No4 Mk1-T Long Branch 303 British - Curios Relics at GunBroker.com : 814379831
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another one, can't make out the serial #on rifle but has scope # 90L8162 scope 170-C
Lee Enfield No4 Mk1-T Long Branch 303 British - Curios Relics at GunBroker.com : 814379831
The rifle itself looks a little suspicious to me. I can't make out the serial number either, but the blurs that are there certainly don't look like a 90L8xxx serial number. No maltese cross on the forestock either.
I'll enter the scope and bracket onto the list.
A friend of mine just payed 1980's prices for a No4T rig from a re-enactor. The rifle is a 1944 BSA # K38711 - but its now wearing the bracket and scope from Longbranch 90L8215 - scope reported as CNo32 MK3 #C13
I have some of his photos, but I get to handle this kit in 2 weeks.
Good morning,
I purchased 90L8162 last week. The rifle just arrived into California, and I had a chance to view it and snap a few pics. Since I live in this lovely state, I wont be able to pic it up until next Saturday, after it clears the 10-day waiting period. At least we have nice weather...
When it comes home, I'll post several pics. For now, here are two of the butt socket and scope/bracket. There is a very small import mark under the barrel, and it is one of Brian Dick's imports. I email him last night, and he confirmed it was one he imported back in 2002.
More to follow in a about a week and a half.
Another one for the list 80L8304
Long Branch No. 4 MKI T Bolt Action Sniper Rifle with Scope | Rock Island Auction
The seller's photos were not very clear and efforts to interpret those have led to some errors in interpretation by well-meaning members here. I have had that problem too, so I sympathise with them. It pays to ask questions and to request clearer photos. I asked for and received several batches of new photos to answer my questions.Quote:
Originally Posted by superbee
The rifle is fine ... very fine in fact.
Long Branch 71L0635, one of the last, not earliest, of the 71L series, 710673 being the highest 71L sniper number I have recorded.
71L0635 has its MATCHING Canadian bracket number 71L0635 C/|\
and its MATCHING C No. 32 Mk. 3 SN 55-C scope made by R.E.L.
The serial number 71L0635 is clear and unaltered on body, bolt and bracket. The serial number on the bracket is engraved with a pantograph as it should be.
The scope serial number has NOT "been tampered with" on the wrist of the wooden butt stock.
The rings have NOT been "crudely renumbered" In fact the rings are NOT numbered at all. It is easy to become confused if looking at images of several different No. 4 (T) rifles at the same time. The same seller was selling at least one and possibly two British BSA Shirley made No. 4 Mk. I (T) at the same time as this Long Branch.
It is a bit unusual that this 71L rifle is fitted with a C No. 32 Mk. 3 instead of a C No. 32 Mk. II scope. Most 71L sniper rifles appear to have been fitted with C No. 32 Mk. II scopes. On my other two 71Lxxxx No. 4 Mk. I*(T) , one has a matching C No. 32 Mk. II scope and the other has a matching in service replacement British made No. 32 Mk. II on the other.
Both the 71L0xxx and 90L8xxx series No. 4 Mk. I* (T) were being produced at the same time, 1945, in the Small Arms Limited, Long Branch. Reports are that the slow delivery of scopes was the delaying factor. Most of the 71L and 90L rifle were destined for the British and the rifles themselves were identical except for the serial number ranges. Thus the understanding is that rifles were ready and awaiting scopes at Long Branch.
In his book WITHOUT WARNING the author, the late Clive Law, wrote on page 41 "distinct serial number blocks; 71Lxxxx consisting of mostly No. 32 Mark 2 scopes, ... and 90L8xxx mounted mostly with the No. 32 Mark 3 scope. However, there is no hard and fast rule..." Note the word "mostly."
Colin, you must have received much better photos than were on their website?Quote:
Originally Posted by Seaforth72
Attachment 101958
it sure looks like the rings are numbered to me?
what is the scope number stamped on the butt?
Early serial numbered Canadian sniper rings were not numbered, nor were the screws punched.
A few other features that were on the later issues were not done as well.
The British complained about this oversight and letters went back and forth before Canada fell into line.
When I find them again, I will post them.
71L0635 - The scope bracket has the matching rifle serial number on it as was proper for the late-war Canadian made examples. This is on the left side in the middle of the bar. There are no numbers on the “rings” (scope clamps) Such numbers, if present, would be on the right side of the bracket.
The photos on the seller’s website were not sharp enough for me and did not show some critical things such as the scope serial number “55C” stamped on the flat of the butt stock just behind the cocking piece. It took two batches of fresh photos to answer my questions adequately. I expect that the inadequate web site photos caused some other potential buyers to hesitate. ;-) I will add that the the seller in Windsor Ontario Canada packed it superbly for shipment and was very fast in shipping so I have no complaints whatsoever.
90L8198 with factory matching scope C No. 32 Mk. 3 22-C moved from the collection of bolt action to that of Seaforth72 some time ago.
Just found this on Gunbroker:
Enfield No. 4 Mk1 (T) British Sniping Rifle 303 S-51 - Curios Relics at GunBroker.com : 854570551
Mis-matched pair; British No4T (less telescope) with a Canadian scope/mount. Serial number on mount 90L8296 and scope number 269-C. Even has matching scope case.
The rifle appears to be a No. 4 Mk. I (T. LESS TELESCOPE) with its matching type No. 15 Mk. I (T. LESS TELESCOPE) marked chest [numbered to BSA No. 4 Mk. I (T) L30940] , and the Canadian R.E.L. C No. 32 Mk. 3 scope and bracket with its scope case C No. 8 Mk. 2, was added either by a surplus dealer or by a civilian owner later on. Note that although the C No. 8 Mk. 2 scope cases were usually not numbered to the scope set, this one is due to the packing label filled out by the famous (to us) "V. BALL" who packed many of these rifles for long-term storage in the early 1960s. Nice items but expensive. The matching rifle 90L8296 has not surfaced yet to my knowledge. Chances are it is in the USA or Canada. The rifle is a 1944 BSA Shirley appears to be serial number M33848 It has the "TR" "S51" mark but not the "T". A 1944 BSA completed as a sniper equipment should have the "T".Quote:
Originally Posted by smle addict
90L8159 for sale here with a early REL MkI scope 2647C
Full Bore, Service and Sniper Rifles for Sale - Devizes Gunsmith
Gun is now marked as sold.
Colin scope 2647c is way out of the normal range. Is it a legit serial number for an REL scope?
Yes this is one of the "double strike" numbers.Quote:
Originally Posted by jawes
It appears that REL double numbered somewhere over 20 scopes - this scope would have originally been 264-c, and then corrected by adding the 7, which implied 8 scopes (2640-c, 2641-c, 2642-c, 2643-c, 2644-c, 2645-c, 2646-c, 2647-c) all originally marked as 264-c !!
If you go back thru my posts, eventually you will find the photos that I posted of this series of "double strikes" showing that the extra digits had to be added to the serial number.
https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=39421Quote:
however we have the duplicate numbered MkI/MkIA/MkII scopes:
264c [ 68L3244-264c (‘43MkIA ******* rings & scope)]
2647c [2647c (44 MKi) in brit mount on Brit action]
2650-C [68L3255-2650-C (’44 mkI)]
2651c [68L3260-2651c (tin)]
3840c [71L0332-3840C (MkIA)]
3845c [71L0355-3845c (tin)]
3854c [71L0439-3854-c(44 MKii)]
Implying a minimum of 21 repeated serial numbers - fixed by adding an extra digit to the serial number.
The interesting serial numbers are 2647c because "647c" is FAR too high to be a MkI (so the parent number must be 264c), and the 3840c thru 3854c as "854c" is FAR higher than the highest (currently) known MkII scopes are in the early 700c range (so the parent numbers must be 384c and 385c).
The rifle butt shows the number 201C stamped in as the original scope For infoQuote:
Originally Posted by jawes
I've seen several of these four digit serial REL No32's over the years & they've always seemed somewhat of an enigma. Out of curiosity, does anyone know WHY they were given the extra digit? I've no idea, but wondered if maybe REL inadvertently gave a small number of scopes the same serial number, & once noticing the error added the extra digit at the front to make each one uniquely identifiable once again. Just a thought....
Sorry for veering slightly off topic.
I just picked up No32 MK 1A 249-C in bracket 74L0409
Are you able to post a significant quantity of quality pictues......I'm sure we would all love to have a look!!Quote:
Originally Posted by jlacy
There were a number of 71L block scope mounts miss numbered as 74LQuote:
Originally Posted by jlacy
More ....Small updates to list
90L8067 now paired with REL 20-C Mk 3
90L8069 with 219-C MK3 matched
90L8115 now paired with 276-C Mk2
90L8212 with 227-C MK3 matched
90L8310 with 314-C MK3 matched
71L0527 now paired with REL 626-C MK2
New 71L0573 paired with 690C matched
74L0024 with 4535S Lyman Alaskan matched
Looking for 35-C, 78-C and 638-C with trades to offer https://www.milsurps.com/images/smilies/cheers.gif
All changes made. I suspect Jawes has one of the larger collections of 90Ls in existence.
Seems like more of the rifles have not been showing up lately. Eventually they will surface.
Thanks. Colin ( seathforth ) and I are in a race to see whom can get the most locally :madsmile:
Still looking for a 68L and and an 80L :sos:
Scope 231c with bracket 90L8219 are mounted on a bsa rifle at centurion-auctions currently.
from the original post:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormald1995
90L8219........................................nco zzo..........................Butt shows scope number 227C, no scope presently
which is interesting because 90L8212 rings have 227c as the scope
I have 90L8218 and 71L0373 which now has bracket 71L0374Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Enfield
90L8159 is currently on UK Guntrader with mismatched REL scope.
I have acquired a Lyman Alaskan with British Broad Arrow (not C), serial 4595S.
Is it one of the 350 used on Enfield Sniper?
That scope is within the serial range of the no32TP.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickvz
If it's the scope posted on snipershide the other day, yes, quite probably it is a Canadian contract.
Restoring Long Branch No.4Mk.1*T, sn. 71L0291 w/mismatch British bracket and REL Mk.1 telescope, sn. 216-C.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1047652775
90L8273-348c scope
on rifle 90L8024 marked to 24C,
but that 24C looks like an overstamp to me of the orginal scope number.
previously sold at Rock Island A 12.3.17 https://www.rockislandauction.com/Lot 3391