Almost 1600.00 dollars for a somewhat put together carbine.. not bad.
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Almost 1600.00 dollars for a somewhat put together carbine.. not bad.
Look at picture 32. The receiver has been blasted and the barrel has not. A real good put together.
I believe I have seen credible evidence that Winchester used both types (I call them hi-weld & lo-weld) of unmarked Type 2 bands. This apparently un-messed-with Winchester barrel with lo-weld band is one example. I have heard the unmarked lo-weld band also referred to as an Inland band.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveHH
Just for general curiosity, what source or sources are you using? I am always open to learning something new. From what I've read, Winchester type 2 bands have the screw hole slightly lower than the two pinch marks. It was the Inland and Standard Products type 2 bands that the screw lined up even with the pinch marks for example. Of course Inland used other suppliers of the type 2 band too.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipS
ChipS said, "I believe I have seen credible evidence that Winchester used both types (I call them hi-weld & lo-weld) of unmarked Type 2 bands."
I think about 75% above to 25% centered is what I am thinking.
deldriver said, "What source or sources are you using?"
From many original 5.7 Winchesters I have and seen.
So to be honest, you should not believe it as fact. Just consider it a possibility until you have a original 5.7 in your hands and you see it for yourself.
But it looks like ChipS and myself believe it to be a real part used by Winchester.
Fact may not be the right word. Maybe a strong reality or something.
If I see a centered band on a 5.7 to 6.6 Winchester, I would not jump to the conclusion that it is an incorrect part.
Years ago I thought all Winchester Type 2 bands were hi-weld and all unmarked lo-weld Type 2 bands were Inland, because that's what Harrison said (please don't laugh). Since that time I have seen numerous photos of Winchester barrels on this site and others, and I have observed several Winchester carbines that I believe were intact, and they wore both types of bands and with no evidence of replacement. Also, I have read posts by learned people whose opinions I value here on this sight, and on others, that surmise both bands as being original Winchester issue. I think the word Bubba-7 was looking for is "probable". We may never know how many of each weld pattern, if any, that Winchester may have asembled or when they did it. But I now believe it is probable that Winchester made, or purchased, and used both types of bands, simply because seeing either of them mounted on apparently original Winchester carbines is just not uncommon. ChipSQuote:
Originally Posted by deldriver
I don't think you can have too many reference materials. Books, FM's, Manuals, Newsletters, People to ask questions. But there is something to be said for hands on experience. I took apart and re assembled four batches of 300 carbines each in 1989/90. Probably only 500 since 1991. I would see some of the integrated parts and run to the book, to see if they were correct or not. Oily fingers do smudge pages. Had to buy a second War Baby.
As Roger says, don't jump to the conclusion that it is an incorrect part.
Hell, part of the fun with this hobby is finding something "new" different then the norm.
Since I own an original 5.6 Win, I pay attention to most stuff I can find on these carbines. The context for BQ's opinions may have been the C marked type 3 bands, I don't recall. He also may not have opined that all of the Win bands were this way. I remembered this because the Winchester bands were the only ones exhibiting this quirk. At the time and on that other board, calling parts and cartouches fakes was absolutely the fun thing to do for a lot of people, even Seth. Most opinions were wrong I might add. This is a good reminder for me to keep my opinions about this stuff to myself, I don't know enough nor have I seen enough carbines to offer anything beyond what I own. According to War Baby, Seymore Smith (among others) made front band assemblies for both Winchester and Inland, it is probably very possible that parts were mixed from the supplier to each Company.
Trust me guys, I've learned to NOT say anything is impossible or possible with the M1 carbine. I am however always open to learning based on (credible) reference materials and many of the people who frequent forums like this one and others. I have a 5.74 Winchester as I've stated already in this thread. It has the band most people who know to expect on it with the lower position screw hole on it. I also have a very late production Standard Products that has a type 2 band with the screw hole even with the pinch marks. None of that means the Winchester couldn't have come with a similar band to what my SP has on it is the point I'm trying to make.
Dave, I have seen BQ make some remarks about Winchester having shortages of the type 3 band. I have a 6.56 Winchester with a SA band on it. It seems like there is a decent possibility that Winchester may have used type 3 bands from different suppliers to make up for their shortages all the way up to the end of production possibly.
It is thought that Winchester may have used some SA made type 3 bands on later production but printed material saying such as far as I know has not been documented as of yet. So if one has a late Winchester with an SA band and the rest is Winchester I would not change it.