US Soldier takes 2 Prisoners with a Pistol

This is obviously a staged photograph. I'm sure both the photographer and the GI were demonstrating the irony of having captured both the Germans and their weapons. I'm sure that this photograph was intended to be far more humorous when it was taken than we, 70 years later, are perceiving it.

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Originally Posted by Eaglelord17

Or possibly acknowledging that the P38 is a better pistol than the 1911.

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Everyone is entitled to their opinion about this, but, as an officer in the U.S. Navy (and my father before me in the Pacific theatre) that actually had the 1911 strapped on his side in combat, I can attest, along with millions of other users, there is no finer weapon you'd want as a partner for protection. My father, upon returning from Okinawa and Iwo Jima, took only one weapon back -- his 1911 Colt.

In the original tests from 1911 (before WWI) this weapon fired 6000 rounds without a failure -- that's why it has been in service for so long. Plus, it fires 7 rounds, not just 6 from a revolver; reloads in mere seconds, and packs a punch.

John Browning was arguably the best automatic weapon designer that has ever lived. Everything from the 1903 or 1911 pistol, the BAR, the MaDeuce, or the A-5 shotgun to name a few, are the most reliable rapid fire designs ever produced. Even my little Colt Woodsman 22 is a superb work of art.

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Originally Posted by Paul S.

... no kind words for the 1911 - or any automatic for that matter, and called them 'unreliable'. He always preferred .38 revolvers.

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Again, that was his opinion.

Personally, I put my trust in a 9mm Browning High Power as I have done for decades.

---------- Post added at 10:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:21 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by Seaspriter

This is obviously a staged photograph.
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John Browning was arguably the best automatic weapon designer that has ever lived. Everything from the 1903 or 1911 pistol, the BAR, the MaDeuce, or the A-5 shotgun to name a few, are the most reliable rapid fire designs ever produced. Even my little Colt Woodsman 22 is a superb work of art.

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I agree on both points. The photo has all the earmarks of staging for the camera. The MP has no webbing on for a start and the look on the two prisoners faces suggest that they may have been promised hot (real) coffee ant it was their fifth or sixth take before the photographer was happy.

Browning was indeed a genius.

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Originally Posted by Paul S.

The MP has no webbing on for a start and the look on the two prisoners faces suggest that they may have been promised hot (real) coffee and it was their fifth or sixth take before the photographer was happy.

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Good observations Paul. I'll have you on my intelligence team any time!:thup:

`Tis the age-old .45 / 9 Para controversy all over again. A bit like Sunni / Shiite or Prod / Catholic or beer v. wine drinkers. Just to fuel the fire: there´s more 9mm sold worldwide annually than .45 together with all the other handgun calibres put together! (But I do like to watch a .45 round floating down the range in the sunlight)

I am not saying the 1911 is a bad gun, it is certainly one of the most iconic pistols in existence, and if you were to take someone who knows nothing about guns, they might be able to recognize a 1911, Luger and maybe a C96 (or at least the names).

As far as it goes I really don't care what pistol I am issued provided it can shoot its rounds downrange reliably. Caliber doesn't matter too much, I remember reading a story about a cop who put 6rds of .45 into a guy at point blank range and it didn't kill him, now the cop carries a 9mm with as many rounds as possible.

Just as far as designs go if John Browning had perfected the handgun at the 1911, why did continue to design handguns and carry on to design the Hi-Power? Which is my choice handgun at the moment for a combat pistol. Personally I wish Mannlicher had been born a little later so he would have had more time to play with smokeless powder, I would have loved to see the results of that.

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Originally Posted by Eaglelord17

if John Browning had perfected the handgun at the 1911, why did continue to design handguns and carry on to design the Hi-Power?

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The process of invention is compulsive in the inventor; Browning is known as the most prolific of weapons designers. Invention was a major theme in the culture of the time. Just look at Thomas Edison, a contemporary of Browning, who filed a patent on the average of every 21 days for the 65 years he was inventing.

I suspect John Moses Browning died with a number of inventions in his head, much like Edison, who said: "I would like to live about 300 years, I think I have IDEAS enough to keep me busy that long."

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Originally Posted by Eaglelord17

a cop who put 6rds of .45 into a guy at point blank range and it didn't kill him, now the cop carries a 9mm with as many rounds as possible.

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A 45 ACP hollow point will blow a hole on the backside you can stuff your fist into. It's a dangerous round. The cop whose 45 would not take someone down probably was dealing with a crazed, drug addicted maniac -- even a 30-06 wouldn't take him out.

Most people are surprised to learn that the most deadly round (in non-war situations) is the .22, which has been attributed to have killed more people than all other rounds combined. It is the weapon most found causing deaths in domestic disputes. While the first round might not take down a victim, several rapid-fire rounds can do a massive amount of damage. In the words of Ernest Hemingway (1938):
".....buy .... a .22 caliber Colt automatic pistol, Woodsman model, with a five-inch barrel and a box of shells...... get lubricated hollow points to avoid jams and to ensure a nice expansion on the bullet..... get several boxes and practice a little...

"Now standing in one corner of a boxing ring with a .22 caliber Colt automatic pistol, shooting a bullet weighing only 40 grains and with a striking energy of 51 foot pounds at 25 feet from the muzzle, I will guarantee to kill either [boxer] Gene [Tunney] or Joe Louis before they get to me from the opposite corner. This is the smallest caliber pistol cartridge made; but it is also one of the most accurate and easy to hit with, since the pistol has no recoil. I have killed many horses with it, cripples and bear baits, with a single shot, and what will kill a horse will kill a man. I have hit six dueling silhouettes in the head with it at regulation distance in five seconds. It was this type of pistol that Millen boys’ colleague, Abe Faber, did all his killings with. Yet this same pistol bullet fired at point blank range will not dent a grizzly’s skull, and to shoot a grizzly with a .22 caliber pistol would simply be one way of committing suicide." --- Hemingway on Hunting

For decades until after WWII, the standard police pistol was .32 or .38. Even the flamboyant General George Patton, in addition to his pearl gripped Colt .45s, carried a 1908 Colt .38 Pocket Hammerless ACP into battle (some authorities say it was a 1903 .32). He was an expert marksman who wanted the most reliable, fast-firing, accurate, rapidly accessible gun he could lay his hands on.

My criteria for a defensive weapon (in order of importance): 1) how easy to handle? 2) how reliable? 3) how accurate? 4) how fast? 5) how powerful?

... and (so I´ve been told) a spent .22 round is impossible to forensically attribute to the weapon it was fired from. Thus, a .22LR firearm must be an ideal murder weapon.

First, I doubt the story of six hits with a .45 unless they were all below the elbow and knee. There is no way a center mass hit would not put him down. No way. NO WAY!

Second, Browning was working for FN and Europe used the 9mm. He was giving the customer what it wanted. The 9mm a fu*king hole-puncher, if it doesn't hit a vital organ it just leaves a pencil-sized streak through tissue, in one side and out the other.

Third, we dropped the .45 in favor of Europe's 9mm for political reasons. They agreed to accept 7.62 NATO for rifles, we agreed to take the 9. It's a crap round.

I'll stick with my 1911, you take your Hi-Power, Glock, P38, Beretta. And what's the trend to 10mm all about? A lousy compromise between caliber and capacity.

Personally I am pretty happy with the 9mm Parabelium/.38 caliber rounds they do everything I could ever want and realistically if I am using that it is because my rifle isn't working for some reason.
Why one cop carries 145 rounds of ammo on the job