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Side note Gil, the stens are broken down with the butt off and shoved into the chest straps of the parachute harness. I know how tight those are supposed to be but they have the butt removed and not even in a weapons container. I personally think having anything hard between me and the harness would hurt on opening shock.
The rifle cases, assuming that is what they are, look like hand stitched packing felt...Look at the crude stitching up the length of the case or ???
Did they cut the stitching or did it just rip out like a feed sack or ???
Interesting and first time I have noticed that method of packing what we are assuming to be a rifle.
If you look closely at the bottom on the one para's foot, you see a snap. I'll bet they slid the weapon in from the end and had a snap fastener.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
Guys,
Thats why like Peter, I was surprised to hear of the work on the NO5 which led to this thorough search of our detailed archive.
There is absolutely no mention of a Paratrooper No5 conversion anywhere, but I know, rather than keep showing off the bronze statue it was also important to show bad practices used to during the war in the carriage of other weapons like the Sten. The 1942 image is a training stick.
Jim it would have certainly broken many bones carried under the harness like that, but heyho, you only do it once :madsmile:
Warren, sorry forgot your question. All our weapons bags are made with the same tough but soft felt when carrying weapons of this ilk. They were retained and reused everytime not disgarded.
I have to say Gil, its interesting the US Airborne troops of the same period appeared to go another way with the M1A1 Carbine scabbard being strapped to the side. Apparently it was heavily padded, but still an issue if you landed on it I should think!
The advantage obviously being that once you had struggled out of your chute, you had your weapon immediately to hand, assembled and ready to go, pop the two fasteners, pull out the M1A1, swing round the stock, and your'e in business....
Unlike the Garand armed guys who had to find the weapons container, get a rifle and put it together, must have been absolutely horrendous and nerve wracking if the DZ was hot....
I suppose the Americans had the delayed advantage of learning from both the Germans and British while assembling and equipping their Airborne forces.
Certainly the US Airborne uniform appears to be the best designed of the bunch re WW2.
John,
Good point as well. When a container hit the ground and you were most probably underfire, you had to defrock your chute and run to where you believed it was, sort through other weapons to find yours. Highly frustrating and must have cost a lot of lives and most probably the reason why the sytems were reviewed towards the end of that war.
Snipers being snipers wouldn't trust other grunts not to snatch their rifles, so they jumped with them.
I did on ONE occasion landwith my container still strapped to me, as I was busy kicking out of mega twists after some prat collided with me in a night drop, and I can tell you even though I was prepared for a side left landing it still hurt a lot to have your weapon, albeit covered in felt, hit your body. The L1A1 barrel is tough and unforgiving!!
So what it must have been like for those in the 82nd and 101st must have been rib tickling:madsmile:
No, they also jumped with their rifle at their leg in a "Griswold" bag. US troops at least... Those are the reusable canvas and felt containers. The M1 was originally broken down to stock, upper receiver and trigger mech groups for packing. You did have to assemble your rifle though...Quote:
Originally Posted by mrclark303
Had one of those cases previously: there was a piece of white nylon strapping similar to a heavy mine tape and a slit in the felt about where the receiver would be when the rifle was in the case. My assumption was the strap was let in through the slit and put around the rifle action (perhaps through the trigger guard). Seem to recall the rifle was to be lowered before hitting the ground, probably to avoid it entangling or striking the soldier as he landed. End closure as a simple web strap with a snap IIRC. Will see if I have photos of it still.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
...And here's a photo I found. Looking at the photo I was mistaken above: the strap must have gone around the wrist of the butt. A No.4(T) would not have fit with the scope mounted.
As for the removable butts on the No.5s, perhaps they were intended for other purposes - weren't the cut down No.1 Mk.V rifles with special stock bolts in TBS described as being done for South Africa police use?
My thread on similar mystery valises. Definitely for the No 4, not the No 5 though.:D
https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=75767
Now that would be interesting to know, tell more please.Quote:
Originally Posted by Surpmil