Un-serialed LB Mk I

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Originally Posted by boltaction

It's possible. It wasn't cheap, but then, no nice LB Mk I is. However, it was part of a package deal with a couple of sniper rifles and an REL observers scope with accessories, so it will come out in the wash. In any case, it is a rifle I'm planning on being buried with (so to speak) so the resale value is not of great relevance.

Ed

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".....it is a rifle I'm planning on being buried with....".......Ed, think that you've just set yourself up for the largest funeral in canadian history......LOL.

Here's a point to ponder............ In the UK and seemingly everywhere else, the body of the rifle is what we call the master component and NEVER available from Ordnance. In fact, never available outside the factory and even there, it's strictly controlled. In fact the body is the rifle.

However, in Canada, as I have been told on several occasions, the rifle body was available as a spare part. (I wonder of Bren or Sten bodies or Sterling bodies were too......) In fact, you could make up a rifle fron 'spare' parts. The question is this........

By what serial number batch were these 'spare part' bodies identified? How were they controlled?> How were the controlled stores registers audited? By which serial number?

I have a zillion other questions to ask if any RCEME Armourer of the era out there can answer

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Originally Posted by Peter Laidler

Here's a point to ponder............ In the UK and seemingly everywhere else, the body of the rifle is what we call the master component and NEVER available from Ordnance. In fact, never available outside the factory and even there, it's strictly controlled. In fact the body is the rifle.

However, in Canada, as I have been told on several occasions, the rifle body was available as a spare part. (I wonder of Bren or Sten bodies or Sterling bodies were too......) In fact, you could make up a rifle fron 'spare' parts. The question is this........

By what serial number batch were these 'spare part' bodies identified? How were they controlled?> How were the controlled stores registers audited? By which serial number?

I have a zillion other questions to ask if any RCEME Armourer of the era out there can answer

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I've seen plenty of "new old stock" LB Sten MkII "body tubes" on the loose in Canada- especially as it is the mag housing which is controlled.

Most registered LB sten MkII have new tubes with older (registered) mag housings

I'm told that unserialed Inglis Bren bodies were common at one point- but I've never seen one myself.

Never heard of an unnumbered C1 sterling, though I have seen several un-numbered C1 rifle bodies.

I have saved pictures of Long Branch C.No7 receiver packaging (dated 1959) which sold last week on CGN, I asked the seller for permission to post them (and if he had any more).
Attachment 34233Attachment 34234

I got the OK to post the pics. I'm told the buyer reported them to both be .22 - Long Branch -1944 marked

It is my understanding that quite some time ago a Cdn collector obtained a lot of about 400 of these stripped .22" receivers. As far as I know, the ones seen floating around are from this batch.
I, too, remember the LB Mk. II Sten main casings being sold. Might even have an old surplus store catalogue listing Sten parts. They had the casings, butts, mechanical parts, but no bolts, barrels or magazine housings. Then the CF cut their remaining Stens, and there was a flood of demilled guns, in varying stages of demilitarization. That solved the problem of magazine housing availability. The registered LB guns Lee Enfield mentionned were probably assembled during this period. At the time, assembling and registering one of these was not a problem.
Never saw a Bren receiver.
It was possible to purchase C1/C2 rifles, C1 smgs directly from LB. Wouldn't have believed it until I saw brand new in the packaging guns, and the paperwork. Chap just thought to ask, and found out they could be purchased.

Superb looking rifle I must say. Two comments: it appears the receiver was refinished after the markings on the left wall were engraved, which suggests some contact with Long Branch post-WWII. The "56" date on the barrel, if that is what that represents, must indicate either the year the barrel was made or the year the rifle was assembled.

My guess would be this was a presentation or someone's retirement gift to themselves or something along those lines. What is interesting is that either these MkI parts were still in stock at Long Branch as late as 1956, or else someone had squirrelled them away gradually over time and assembled this from those parts somewhere else: a LB worker, a military armourer, or anyone who had access to stocks of these parts in the 50s or 60s.

I haven't read the whole thread so if someone has made those points already no plagiarism intended!

Jeeeees........ Canada must have been awash with 'liberated' Stens and suchlike. But I'm sure that I'm not the only one who'd like to know what serial number batch was allocated to Ordnance replacement bodies - if any. Maybe they just diverted a few hundred every so often. Have you got any idea Surpmil?

But that we all lived in Canada during the 60s/70's........

Canada in the '60s and early '70s was a very different place than it is now.
Another item that I saw in that period was one of the RCAF wooden Mk. II Sten buttstocks. Only one I ever saw.
At the same time that the Sten main casings could be had for $15, Inglis Browning frames were $10 without the stock slot, $15 with.
A lot of vet bring backs were surfacing, and there was no problem getting on the right side of the law.
In addition, the obsolete stuff was starting to flood onto the market.
I saw brand new M1A1 Thompsons and MP44s for $135 retail. Saw the invoice, they were US$35 each from Interarmco, FOB Alexandria.

Peter, even a comparative stripling like myself can remember Vickers receivers and casings, boxes of Bren mags and welded (IIRC) Stens for sale in the 70s and even early 80s in these parts. There was a whack of un-numbered LB No4 MkI* receivers out here in BC a few years back I was told, dated 1955 and 56. Since the FN C1 was coming in then, there wasn't much call for No4 "bodies" so they were never used and who knows by what means they were sold off or otherwise liberated. There were some huge surplus sales around here in the 70s and before, and the average public servant :laugh: wouldn't know or care what a No.4 body was, just more stuff to be sold off and cleared out ASAP.

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Originally Posted by Surpmil

Superb looking rifle I must say. Two comments: it appears the receiver was refinished after the markings on the left wall were engraved, which suggests some contact with Long Branch post-WWII. The "56" date on the barrel, if that is what that represents, must indicate either the year the barrel was made or the year the rifle was assembled.

My guess would be this was a presentation or someone's retirement gift to themselves or something along those lines. What is interesting is that either these MkI parts were still in stock at Long Branch as late as 1956, or else someone had squirrelled them away gradually over time and assembled this from those parts somewhere else: a LB worker, a military armourer, or anyone who had access to stocks of these parts in the 50s or 60s.

I haven't read the whole thread so if someone has made those points already no plagiarism intended!

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I've seen the "56" mark on other barrels, and it appears to be a proof mark, not a date stamp. I have another rifle with that stamp and a standard date stamp on it. Also, in the Knowledge Library there is another #4 Mk I LB and in photos 130, 131, 132 and 137 the same stamping can be seen, with the normal date stamp adjacent to it. This link might work (or might not)......
1941 No.4 Mk1 Long Branch Rifle


Ed

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Originally Posted by boltaction

I've seen the "56" mark on other barrels, and it appears to be a proof mark, not a date stamp. I have another rifle with that stamp and a standard date stamp on it. Also, in the Knowledge Library there is another #4 Mk I LB and in photos 130, 131, 132 and 137 the same stamping can be seen, with the normal date stamp adjacent to it. This link might work (or might not)......
1941 No.4 Mk1 Long Branch Rifle

Ed

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I have a LB rebarreled No1MkIII which has a similar inspection marking- I'll have to dig it out and look at it...