Enfield MK3 Bren. Ex Irish Army. UE55 A3024. Appears to be all original with extending leg bipod.
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Enfield MK3 Bren. Ex Irish Army. UE55 A3024. Appears to be all original with extending leg bipod.
I have a BSA BREN MK I sn X3402. appears to be all original parts..... but then I am always suprised with new information.
After a long wait. I have found a 1940 Enfield Mk1 Dove tail. Correct 1* barrel, extending legs bi-pod and hump back butt. Also got a MK1 Enfield magazine. Serial no=D3627. Trigger group is stencilled H8336. I think both of these numbers are mid 1940 production just before the MK1M was put into production. I am told this gun came from Austria where eight Dovetails were found 1939 and 40 dated. D/A by M.Priest June 2013.
D3627 is very probably within the last of the true Mk1's or very early into the first of the of 6 transitional stages from Mk1 to Mk1A. In that the crown/Enfield/1940 on the right hand side (which took a whacking 12 minutes to engrave incidentally) was eliminated for a clearer Mk1/DE/1940 on the left hand side. You'll have to tell us where your markings are for certain. D3627 is probably mid-ish 1940 but the 1940production went up to the F-51xx numbers
Butt slide H8330 is a little way into the start of true Mk1A production. The Mk1A is a simplified Mk1. Britain never produced a Mk1m. This H8338 number should not be stencilled. It should be engraved (or stamped) at the rear of the butt slide above the small of the butt.
X3402 is an Enfield Mk1A from close to the end of 1942 production. I'd say, October ish
D3627 is one of the last Crown 1940 guns. The last observed Crown marked Mk1 on my list is D4414 and the first ED marked gun observed is D4713. H8336 is a mid 1941 Mk1A ptn, the first of which appeared in the F9xxx range, but seeing as its stencilled (I guess that to be electro pencil or engraved) I'd guess it to be re-matched so it could have originally been from any mark or manufacturer, only photos would help ID it. Not sure of the Austria connection, did you buy direct from Mike P? If Kev G comes along he can probably confirm or deny as he has his finger on the pulse when it comes to Brens entering the UK. The Mk1* barrel isn't technically correct for the early guns, the Mk1 barrels were modified to Mk1* spec and from evidence it would appear that the early long cone flash hiders were used on some new made Mk1* barrels from the E up into the G serial numbers (Probably to use up stocks). Peter wrote a little bit about the change in spec between Mk1 and Mk1* barrels, if you search back it will be there somewhere. For the purposes of UK deac early Brens it is mute point seeing as the only visual difference between the Mk1 and Mk1* mod'ed barrel is the addition of a star.
Any chance of posting some photos? Did you get your choice of the 8?
Regarding the serial number of the Bren on the butt slide assembly, I'm not sure that the butt slide actually needed to be numbered to the gun. It either fitted to the gun and worked or it didn't and ALL of those that I ever fitted or had to renew fitted perfectly. The action of the trigger mech and the sear on the piston post was not affected by the body at all, nor was the action of the butt and recoil buffer system. Complete waste of time numbering the butt slide. And numbering or RE-numbering was a real pain. Stamping the number would/could collapse the recess for the body locking pin - a BIG taboo. And engraving meant taking the return spring tube out and reversing the pantograph letters and.............
Evenually, common sense prevailed and it was authorised to engrave the gun number along the lower rear left side of the butt slide (both Bren and L4's), to the rear of the trigger mech. But why number it at all? If they didn't number the breech block (they DID on the L4's) that WERE important, why bother with the butt slide that wasn't? That's todays little moan.....
Back to BP's comment above. I was specially guarded regarding the ACTUAL changepoint of the end of TRUE Mk1 guns and the start of the first Mk1 to Mk1A intermediates because there seems to be a range of mixed numbers where they intermingle a bit so it is a little bit fluid.
The Brens never came from Austria but are probably the last of the Greek guns.They are the last of the batch left that were canibalised for parts to sell the earlier released one's that had damaged or missing parts.As most of the bits are missing on them they have to be built up using spare parts.
Also saw some of the MK2's at the W&P show that were built up from scratch most sporting Belgian made barrel nuts.
Hope someone brings in some more complete Brens at some point !
ATB KG
As a matter of (little....) interest, the difference between a Mk1 and a Mk1* barrel assembly is .008" This is the increased hole size from the gas port in the barrel. And what an absolute bastxxx it was to modify according to old wartime Armourers. This was because the officially issued reamer was rbbish due to the fact that to get from .140" up to the required .148" (the sizes are from memory here.....) the increase had to take place over a depth/distance of .3" - the diameter of the bore! Add to that, the reamer had to start its journed down, reaming away through a hole at an angle to the gas block.
Drilling was an option but the drills weren't the super HSS things we have today. The upshoot was broken reamers and drills and knackered barrels.
All this to allow more gas through the gas port AND the new enlarged ported gas regulators (Mk3's). But all this really did was compound other problems. It was farcical
Dear All, thank you for the posts above. Which are most useful to me. I can confirm all the numbers in my previous post. This is a Kings Crown 1940 engraving on the right side of the Bren gun. I bought this blind from Chelmsford Militaria prior to them taking delivery. I was promised the best one of the eight they purchased. I had looked at a lot of dog awful Dovetails before I found this one. My excuse for buying this is because it's my 53rd birthday today! Photographs to follow in a few days.
We'd rather see photos of the Bren by the way.Quote:
Originally Posted by LesterH
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