1917 end cap re-assembly

I just bought an eddystone m1917 made in 1918. I took it apart to look at the barrel under the wood and to visually inspect the receiver. But I'm having trouble with the end cap. The screw that goes through the middle of it won't bite on the other side. No matter how hard I try to squeeze it, when I'm done, finger pressure on the tip pops it right back out. If I insert it from the other end, the screw will bite on the metal. So I'm guessing the screw is too short? Im pretty sure it was screwed in when I started because it did back out ever so slightly when I unscrewed it and I had to poke it with a punch to get it out.

Anyone got any tips on how to get it back in?

I did not take pictures of the screw or end cap but if they will help I can get some this weekend.

Later I can post pics of the rifle as payment. But I don't know how to attach pics from my mobile.

I'm not familiar with the phrase "correctly dressed screwdriver". Does that just mean the biggest hollow ground screwdriver that fits in the slot?

The screw head was flush with the end cap inside the recess. The more I think about it, unless the end cap can be compressed, the end of the screw must have gotten buggered up when I removed it. When I get back home I'll take a close look at it. Hopefully replacement screws aren't too tough to find.

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Originally Posted by Hoss

then end of the screw must have gotten buggered up when I removed it.

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If the end of the screw was peened over or spread with a punch during the original assembly, as was done on some types of rifle to prevent soldiers from dismantling them, then that is exactly what has happened - the peened end has ruined the screw thread. This may, of course, have been done by a previous user.

Did you have to exert a lot of force when removing the screw?

---------- Post added at 09:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:03 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by Hoss

Im pretty sure it was screwed in when I started because it did back out ever so slightly when I unscrewed it and I had to poke it with a punch to get it out.

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Yep, sounds like the screw thread was already FUBAR and it was only hanging on by the spread metal.

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Originally Posted by Patrick Chadwick

Did you have to exert a lot of force when removing the screw?

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I didn't have to whack it, I just poked it with the punch. I don't think it was very much force and it should have already been away from the metal. Numrich has the screws for $2.50 and the cap for $8. I'd rather not replace the cap but if the screw is just buggered up that will be easy.

Here are some pics I took before I started messing with it. They are all very dark so I'm only posting a few that show interesting stuff. I'll take some pics outside this weekend.

Anyone ever seen the bare wood under the bolt handle and safety? Is that a sign that someone refinished the stock and just didn't stain those parts?

Looks to me like the first couple sets of lands on the end of the screw are flattened. I don't know if that's the peening damage you were talking about but I'm going to try a new one from numrich.

Attachment 103171

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Originally Posted by Hoss

Anyone ever seen the bare wood under the bolt handle and safety? Is that a sign that someone refinished the stock and just didn't stain those parts?

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It looks to me as if someone shaved off a sliver of wood beneath the bolt handle. Deduction: it didn't fit, as it surely would have done when it left the arsenal, so something was altered - new bedding or replacement stock.

Filed or shaved beneath the bolt handle and the safety lever. So the system was sitting too low in the wood. Since wood does not normally expand on rifles stocks, but rather shrinks a little over decades, I reckon there is something non-original about the barrelled system/stock combination. Considering that together with the front band/screw problem, I think you need to check the rifle over minutely for other signs of mishandling.

Thanks, I believe you are on to something. There's an R on the bottom of the bolt that makes me think it's got at least 1 remington part. The bolt handle itself has an E, but the protrusion on the underside looks like it can be removed if you know how. I don't know enough about guns to name the part with the R, but I plan to figure it out when I have time. I also haven't seen (or looked very hard for) a cartouche on the stock yet, so it's possible it's not an eddystone stock.

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Originally Posted by Hoss

...I also haven't seen (or looked very hard for) a cartouche on the stock yet, so it's possible it's not an eddystone stock.

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Normally, on an M1917, the muzzle-end face of the front end of the stock has a letter stamp E or R or W.

I think you would find this book useful:

"United States Model of 1917" by C.S. Ferris. Scott A. Duff Publications. ISBN 1-888722-14-2.

It has comprehensive lists of parts markings, inspectors's marks etc.

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Originally Posted by Patrick Chadwick

Normally, on an M1917, the muzzle-end face of the front end of the stock has a letter stamp E or R or W.

I think you would find this book useful:

"United States Model of 1917" by C.S. Ferris. Scott A. Duff Publications. ISBN 1-888722-14-2.

It has comprehensive lists of parts markings, inspectors's marks etc.

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Thanks, I'll look into it. The only markings I found on the stock was "2K" behind the trigger guard. I see what you're talking about though, I didn't get any pictures from that angle last weekend. I did find one piece that appears to have an E and an R on the inside. This is one of the upper handguards.

Attachment 103186Attachment 103187Attachment 103188

In my very limited experience of 3 or 4 examples, I do not think the screw that you show in Post #5 is the correct screw for a M1917 or P14 front band. The ones on hand here have larger bodies, than the reduced diameter threaded ends. And, to boot, it is my impression that those will be a BA thread - carry over from dragging British tooling over to USA to build the things. From what I am seeing, my guess is someone "forced" a normal USA screw into that front band.

The part you show in third picture in Post #10 with the "R" is commonly called the "cocking piece". It is attached to the rear of the firing pin, slides within the bolt plug / bolt sleeve, has a face that is acted on by the trigger sear and has a notch on the side to be acted on by the safety. Apparently depends whether you are British or American for the correct name, but the "bolt plug a.k.a. bolt sleeve" or "bolt shroud" (if it was a Mauser rifle) screws into the rear of the bolt body. So, you have an "E" bolt body with an "R" cocking piece. The firing pin and the "bolt plug/sleeve" will also have a maker's mark.

A quick and easy reference for M1917 parts markings can be found on m1903.com > Marks > M1917 parts. Some minor errors, but very handy reference. Click on the part name and a sketch pops up showing where each maker put their mark on a part - sometimes the same place, most times not.

Besides the above mentioned book by C. S. Ferris, consider getting the book "Pattern 1914 and U.S. Model of 1917" by Charles R. Stratton.

The original US Army document - something like "Rules Of Management for US Rifle of 1917" is readily available on Internet and shows procedures that WWI soldiers were taught to disassemble and re-assemble. They would have been able to disassemble and reassemble the bolt assembly while sitting in the rain in a muddy ditch, without using any tools! Also good information found on the CMP site about these rifles.

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Originally Posted by Potashminer

The part you show in third picture in Post #10 with the "R" is commonly called the "cocking piece". It is attached to the rear of the firing pin, slides within the bolt plug / bolt sleeve, has a face that is acted on by the trigger sear and has a notch on the side to be acted on by the safety. Apparently depends whether you are British or American for the correct name, but the "bolt plug a.k.a. bolt sleeve" or "bolt shroud" (if it was a Mauser rifle) screws into the rear of the bolt body. So, you have an "E" bolt body with an "R" cocking piece. The firing pin and the "bolt plug/sleeve" will also have a maker's mark.

A quick and easy reference for M1917 parts markings can be found on m1903.com > Marks > M1917 parts. Some minor errors, but very handy reference. Click on the part name and a sketch pops up showing where each maker put their mark on a part - sometimes the same place, most times not.

Besides the above mentioned book by C. S. Ferris, consider getting the book "Pattern 1914 and U.S. Model of 1917" by Charles R. Stratton.

The original US Army document - something like "Rules Of Management for US Rifle of 1917" is readily available on Internet and shows procedures that WWI soldiers were taught to disassemble and re-assemble. They would have been able to disassemble and reassemble the bolt assembly while sitting in the rain in a muddy ditch, without using any tools! Also good information found on the CMP site about these rifles.

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Thanks potashminer. I haven't been back to the site in a while and didn't expect I'd have more replies. So it's a confirmed Mixmaster, which doesn't bother me. I didn't see any receiver cracks, didn't close on the field gauge, and went bang everytime I pulled the trigger. So I'm happy with it so far. Sometime this month I'll find out how it shoots in a proper range session.

I just noticed that there's a manual in the sticky section. Is that the same manual you're talking about?