Breda M1D 308 sniper

When a couple of these came up on G-Broker about 8 months ago I was hoping more would come available so when some showed up @ Palmetto State Armory about 2 weeks ago I plopped down some coin and purchased one. Early reports where mostly good but there where a couple of duds also delivered to a few customers so I waited and wondered what I would get.

Well Big Brown delivered mine today and I am very pleased with it. The Transit case is in great shape, the scope is clear and the turrets work well. The stock is clean and the metal is all in great shape. The bore is beautiful and except for the scope not being a matching on it you would be hard to upgrade on this one.
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Nice rifle, I'd love to bring the bandoleers to help you warm that one up. Very nice.

I was too young and poor when they were released to the market here almost 30 years ago...
I’d have picked up this and an Enfield.
Enjoy!!!

Ovidio, do you know what all was included with these rifles in Italian service?

Not really. I will ask on my other forum and hopefully be able to tell you all asap.

So, I got some answers and pictures, but downloading from the site is a tad problematic. I must see how to get through.
The content of the crate is written on the labels inside the lid, and, if I'm not wrong, that must be pretty close, if not the same, as what the UK or the US put in there.
One picture I could download as jpeg, the others have some strange extensions. I can't visualise them.

Attachment 116787

I wonder if the same group was selling the parts separately. Within the last month I've seen flash hiders, thick and thin, as well as Italian M1D manuals on ebay. I had no interest but they were expensive compared to what they use to sell for, but now I know why. Collectors needed to complete their kits.

It seems that in May 2019, the Italian Army sold about 400 Garand T2 TS. They wentto Austria and then half of them to the US. Some were missing some accessories, some also the optic.
Some have BM59 bolts, like this one (it seems).
Others may very well have been completed by the dealer.
All in all, mostly original.

Outstanding Rifle, Miller Tyme. I was looking at those yesterday at Palmetto as i was putting together my new order and i was drooling at the thought and now I see the box and wish I had saved that money for another investment instead of TACH TOYS.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ovidio

It seems that in May 2019, the Italian Army sold about 400 Garand T2 TS. They wentto Austria and then half of them to the US. Some were missing some accessories, some also the optic.
Some have BM59 bolts, like this one (it seems).
Others may very well have been completed by the dealer.
All in all, mostly original.

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Thanks for the info Ovidio, from what I had been told by a friend about 8 months ago only about 150 of the ones coming in to the US had scopes.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ovidio

It seems that in May 2019, the Italian Army sold about 400 Garand T2 TS. They wentto Austria and then half of them to the US. Some were missing some accessories, some also the optic.
Some have BM59 bolts, like this one (it seems).
Others may very well have been completed by the dealer.
All in all, mostly original.

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Hi Ovidio, by any chance, do you have any pictures you could share of Italian snipers using those rifles?

Unfortunately not.
I’ll look for info, but I guess that we never really used those rifles.
When I was in the army, we had quite a few of those rifles in the armory, but we didn’t have any marksmen or snipers in the normal outfits.
Shortly before the end of my servive, somewhere around late spring ‘95, we were asked to select a few privates for marksman/sniper course.
But they were never trained.
Maybe after that, but I would bet they were issued more modern weapons.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ovidio

Unfortunately not.
I’ll look for info, but I guess that we never really used those rifles.
When I was in the army, we had quite a few of those rifles in the armory, but we didn’t have any marksmen or snipers in the normal outfits.
Shortly before the end of my servive, somewhere around late spring ‘95, we were asked to select a few privates for marksman/sniper course.
But they were never trained.
Maybe after that, but I would bet they were issued more modern weapons.

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Thank you for replying! Now you have my even bigger attention, ha! By any chance do you know how sniper school / training was looking like at that time? Sorry for all the questions...

Don’t worry. You got me curious too now.
I hope my range buddy, LTCol. in the Bersaglieri, will be able to tell me.

I got some info.
He confirmed that the marksmen/sniper program started in late ‘94, which makes sense also with my memories, because in October we had terrible floods in Piedmont and all training was stopped to help the polulation of the struck areas. In November, until January, we made lots of exercise for Strong Resolve ‘95, which was in February. Our soldiers ended their year and we got a fully new crew in early March. I bet that somewhere between April and May we got that info about the course, but then we went to “summer camp” and then to Calabria on a mission against mafia.
So we never started that program that year.
He confirmed that the Garands TS were in fact used at the beginning, to train the soldiers in the use of the optics and for creating the shooting tables. But they were very limited at the time, so they were very quickly retired from sevice and substituted with Mc Millans and Iver Johnson’s. Then, after a short while came the Sako and Accuracy International. But in my friends regiment, when they went to Iraq and fought the battle for the Nasiriya bridges, they had self acquired Steyr SSGs (2 of them) and high-end reloading equipment (also self acquired).
He’s trying to find out if some of his mates still have some older magazines, where this new marksmen/sniper program was covered at the time.

Thank you Ovidio for this useful knowledge!
My breda import Typo 2 with scope is mostly 100 percent new condition and packed well.
However the muzzle wear is at 2.5 on a gauge, so has been shot some. Maybe earlier training as you stated.
I Like the the info you have provided, and look forward to more from the mates who were involved.

Attachment 117085Attachment 117086Attachment 117087Attachment 117088Attachment 117089Attachment 117090Received my rifle sans scope the other day. The transit case is ok but the joints are a little loose and the paint is flaking but generally sound. the rifle looks fresh from rebuild with no scope plate and while the stock is completely serviceable it has clearly been through a rebuild.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ovidio

I got some info.
He confirmed that the marksmen/sniper program started in late ‘94, which makes sense also with my memories, because in October we had terrible floods in Piedmont and all training was stopped to help the polulation of the struck areas. In November, until January, we made lots of exercise for Strong Resolve ‘95, which was in February. Our soldiers ended their year and we got a fully new crew in early March. I bet that somewhere between April and May we got that info about the course, but then we went to “summer camp” and then to Calabria on a mission against mafia.
So we never started that program that year.
He confirmed that the Garands TS were in fact used at the beginning, to train the soldiers in the use of the optics and for creating the shooting tables. But they were very limited at the time, so they were very quickly retired from sevice and substituted with Mc Millans and Iver Johnson’s. Then, after a short while came the Sako and Accuracy International. But in my friends regiment, when they went to Iraq and fought the battle for the Nasiriya bridges, they had self acquired Steyr SSGs (2 of them) and high-end reloading equipment (also self acquired).
He’s trying to find out if some of his mates still have some older magazines, where this new marksmen/sniper program was covered at the time.

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Thank you Ovidio!

It is a pleasure to be helpful. My knowledge is very limited, since I’m more of a shooter than a collector, but like a broken clock, every day I’m right twice:lol:

I just got some more info from a friend of mine, from my same Officer's Course.
In his free time, he develops war games with a group of international nerds (joke) like him, and he bumped into information about the use of the Garand in the Italian sniper version, the TS.
They were issued to the border guards until the 1970ies, and were used.
I joked about it saying that in my opinion, they were used more for poaching in uniform than for guarding the borders, but still... I think that can fit here as info.

Interestingly enough, in the mid-90ies we still had the same "wooden" boots, the same sweater, the same canvas belt (was changed during my service to another one), the same leggings over the boots (never used)...
Also the Norwegian hat is the same.

Attachment 118117

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ovidio

"wooden" boots,

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Called that because they had no bend and a full shank? No flex to them?

They were stiff like wood. Height was ok. Like normal mountain boots. But the leather and the soles… Argh!

Thanks for the additional information Ovidio

My pleasure

Thanks for all the good information you provide. I wonder if you know my friend Corso Boccia who lives in Florence... he has always been a wealth of information on Italian Garands of all types. If you don't know him, you should.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bob seijas

Thanks for all the good information you provide. I wonder if you know my friend Corso Boccia who lives in Florence... he has always been a wealth of information on Italian Garands of all types. If you don't know him, you should.

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Hi Bob, I don’t know him. But he could be helpful for detailed info concerni g the use of the Garand TS by our border guards, abouth whom I really don’t know anything.