Primer manufacturing- Why not ?

It seems as if the ultra high demand for primers will not end soon. Maybe I am wrong but it would seem that these little things that have no moving parts, and have been made since before the turn of the last century could be made in large numbers by many small manufacturers instead of a few large ones. Why dont we have a hundred small manufacturers of primers ?
We have micro breweries, micro vinyards, even low production distilleries for bourbon. We have more manufacturers of weed eater string than primers and powder. The boom of firearms, and ammo businesses is a case study of free market capitolism. Where are the entrapenures with start up manufacturing of high demand products ? What would it take for me to start making primers ?

Quote:

---

What would it take for me to start making primers ?

---

Hmmmm...for starters I would think:

Financing for R&D, manufacturing equipment, labor force, warehouse space, sales force, distribution network, an advertising budget, a sound reputation on the market, and meeting all the Federal & State guidelines and approvals.

Primers ain't beer! YOU got an advanced degree in high-energy chemistry and willing to work around large quantities of lead styphenate? Go ahead, you can have my place in line...I did my time in that kind of environment and still carry scars...others weren't as lucky!

The Olin-Winchester primer plant is/was located in the middle of bum-fu**ing nowhere near Orwell, Ohio...had portions of it blow-up fairly frequently, and was a registered "Super-Fund" site while it was still being used. Permitting of a new production facility would be next to impossible from about 4 different directions!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JB White

Hmmmm...for starters I would think:

Financing for R&D, manufacturing equipment, labor force, warehouse space, sales force, distribution network, an advertising budget, a sound reputation on the market, and meeting all the Federal & State guidelines and approvals.

---

Not to mention that the manufacture of the primer mixture itself is a rather complicated (if you want commerical grade material) and potententially dangerous process.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kcw

Not to mention that the manufacture of the primer mixture itself is a rather complicated (if you want commerical grade material) and potententially dangerous process.

---

Potentially??? Bud, if it's "shock-sensitive" enough to be used as a primer, there's no "potential" about it....it's dangerous stuff! Not to mention the "L" word (lead as in lead styphnate) making it highly toxic to work with as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by John Kepler

Potentially??? Bud, if it's "shock-sensitive" enough to be used as a primer, there's no "potential" about it....it's dangerous stuff! Not to mention the "L" word (lead as in lead styphnate) making it highly toxic to work with as well.

---

Back in Oct. of 1934 a thief managed to break into Remington's powder magazine @ Bridgeport. He took off with ten two-pound cans of polnol, probably thinking it was powder. Polnol, is one of the raw ingredients of the primer mixuture; it's one of the most volitile substances ever made. The amount taken could level a large part of the city.
Everyone up through the FBI was called in. Remington put large ads in the local papers warning whomever had the stuff to not touch it , just let the authorities know where it was, no other questions would be asked.
A few days later the stuff was found, by a search party of local police and Remington guards, hidden in some rocks, not far from the powder magazine.
Considering the handling that the cans must have gone through in order to be transported to the place that they were found, Remington employees nominated the thief for the title of "luckiest man of the year."

As KCW says, priming mixture, unlike smokeless powder, is a true high explosive and sensitive. Trying to make it at home could give a new meaning to "wreck room".

Jim

They are as much an art as science. yes, the whole thing is done by hand.

Match Rifle Ammo: Is factory match-grade ammunition really worth it? Petty puts it to the test | Guns Magazine | Find Articles at BNET

Reminded me of three "idiots" in Arizona many years ago.
To set the scene, Open pit Copper mines use a LOT of explosives and it is stored in bunkers away from the site. Now the bunker is secured by a locked steel door marked appropriately.

These three idiots had an 03 springfield and some AP ammo that they wanted to test. Guess what they used as a target!:madsmile:
Two of them got behind a large rock while the third "tested" his ammo on the door. The bunker contained FIVE tons of dynamite and another five tons of blasting powder.

The shooter had an arm blown off, one of the others was reduced to incoherence from the shock, and the third was only deafend.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fick_2141

It seems as if the ultra high demand for primers will not end soon. Maybe I am wrong but it would seem that these little things that have no moving parts, and have been made since before the turn of the last century could be made in large numbers by many small manufacturers instead of a few large ones. Why dont we have a hundred small manufacturers of primers ?
We have micro breweries, micro vinyards, even low production distilleries for bourbon. We have more manufacturers of weed eater string than primers and powder. The boom of firearms, and ammo businesses is a case study of free market capitolism. Where are the entrapenures with start up manufacturing of high demand products ? What would it take for me to start making primers ?

---

So if it has been covered, excuse me. The answer(s) to your question are....

1- Product Liability Insurance. It's expensive.

2- Explosive Licenses for the components used.

3- Time and Expense to test the product for consistancy and develop Loading Data for using your brand of primer.

4- There is plenty more to consider for starting up a new manufacturing enterprise; machinery, tooling, employees, etc. NOT easy to do and takes time. By then maybe there will be no market for your product.

A good example is the AR-15 market. For 8 months they were hard to get and when we got one it sold. Now we have 6 in stock and when I check the store email daily ALL of our distributors are telling me how many they have and offering special pricing to take them off their hands. The fire has gone out on that market.

FWIW,

Emri

In a relatively short time, primers will be showing up at discount prices. As the demand slackens, and some of the primers now in stock are put on the market, not only will they be readily available, but at discount prices.

If you remember the primer shortage a few years ago, this very thing happened. I still have thousands of pistol primers I bought at about $5.00 per thousand when the supply overwhelmed the demand.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by John Sukey

Reminded me of three "idiots" in Arizona many years ago.
To set the scene, Open pit Copper mines use a LOT of explosives and it is stored in bunkers away from the site. Now the bunker is secured by a locked steel door marked appropriately.

These three idiots had an 03 springfield and some AP ammo that they wanted to test. Guess what they used as a target!:madsmile:
Two of them got behind a large rock while the third "tested" his ammo on the door. The bunker contained FIVE tons of dynamite and another five tons of blasting powder.

The shooter had an arm blown off, one of the others was reduced to incoherence from the shock, and the third was only deafend.

---

John S., Was that the shack at the base of push peak in the mid '70s?
john

Local dealers are getting more stuff in now,including primers(again) just this past week. This is the third week in a row I've seen primers on the shelf. Racks are full of black guns again,and lots of them,and primers are not selling out daily as they have posted a 1 box limit per customer for each primer type. Cheap loaded ammo still seems thin pickins but is slowly improving. I think the panic buying is slowing a bit.

the simpler and cheaper the end product often it is hardest or most complicated to manufacture (and make a profit).

Agreed,

I believe much of this situation was caused by 'panic buying' -
It's been all over the internet that supplies are short --
Threads and more threads about it.
Then even more panic buying and hording. Prices went WAY up because of this short term (for them) lack of sufficient production to fill the demand they couldn't keep up with. Hopefully the horders haven't caused a situation where the prices will not go back down, but they should decrease when supply catches back up. And it will.

It would be irresponsible financially for manufacturers to produce a much larger volume of ammo for a short term hording situation crated by panic. They can't expand manufacturing facilities, buy a larger fleet, and hire a much larger workforce to produce higher volumes of special ammo like .30 carbine when supply will eventually catch up with demand once the horders have enough ammo they purchased at these inflated prices.

If there was actually a demand that would be permanent you can be assured they'd expand facilities and make more ammo. Especially at the prices they're getting presently! JMO

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by cafdfw

I believe much of this situation was caused by 'panic buying' - It's been all over the internet that supplies are short -- Threads and more threads about it. Then even more panic buying and hording. Prices went WAY up because of this short term (for them) lack of sufficient production to fill the demand they couldn't keep up with. Hopefully the horders haven't caused a situation where the prices will not go back down, but they should decrease when supply catches back up. And it will.

---

Well, if the skyrocketing prices for ammunition were only for those calibers in high demand, such as 5.56 (.223), 7.62x51 (.308), 7.62x39mm, and 9mm, I would agree with your contentions. I can even see how closing the Federal ammunition plants by Congress increased the pressure on commercial manufacturers for these calibers. However, I just priced out some .45-70 hunting ammunition (Remington soft points, 405 grain) and it now sells for about $2.00 per round! This is a result of panic buying of .45-70? I don't think so. .380 ACP isn't used by the military, but it is very hard to find, at any price. Recently I saw a 50 round box of .357 priced at $99.00 at a Gander Mountain store near me... Prices are going into orbit for calibers that are NOT in high demand. There is more to this ammunition shortage/reloading supply shortage/price hike than simple supply and demand. There is an "invisible hand" at work here, and it's not Adam Smith's. KarlKW

I think when the ammo companies were able to raise prices to ridiculous levels because of panic and they were still selling they have raised their prices across the board. They are no different than the oil companies gouging. The retail stores see whats going on and they are gouging as well.
As I said, it's JMO

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jamie5070

John S., Was that the shack at the base of push peak in the mid '70s?
john

---

I really don't remember, I only read an article about it. Just proves ya can't fix stupid! Firing AP rounds through the door of a powder magazine is NOT even at idiot level of behaviour:madsmile:

On ammo prices. It's not that the factories are gouging you on the price of other than military style rifle and pistol ammo. It's the fact that making other calibres still ties up the basic somponents, ie; brass, primers, powder and the machinery to make it. When the supply of stuff like .308, .5.56 .45ACP, finaly catches up, the price on other calibres is going to drop as well.

In any case, the current price of ammo is an excellent reason to start reloading.
Lots of folks complain about the initial cost, but forget that once you have the basics, loading for other calibres is simply a matter of changing dies.

Oh by the way, if you are just dumping that 45-70 brass instead of reloading it, I would be happy to pay the postage if you want to send it to me:D

have already been covered quite well. But there are at least two good reference books available which have more specific information useful to anyone contemplating such a venture:
"Principles and Practice of Loading Ammunition" , by Earl Naramore, and;
"Making Ammunition", which was and may still be available from the NRA Publications folks.
It is not a kitchen chemistry project. And your insurance company would certainly not be amused.
mhb - Mike

and the 'fire' will soon go out of the primer market and be back to normal. Otherwise the present makers would just expand operations.