11 mm Egyptian Martini musket

Bought one of these many years ago, might have been from Navy Arms or Ye Olde Hunters Lodge. Would like to be able to shoot it now. Anyone ever shoot one? Think I read the British left the chamber original and made new cartridges up so it could be used as a shotgun. It measures .475 inch at the muzzle and is smooth bored. Will the 577 brass fit the chamber? If so might make a slug gun of it. Can I get a barrel to return it to the original caliber?

Right side of receiver has a Crown. under that is V.R, next line is H.R.B.-Co, next is 1893. under that might be a small crown with an arrow pointing down from it and under that stamped 11.

Does anyone make an insert for this chamber? Maybe I can shoot .410 shotshells through it???

Thanks for any help
Phil

stockerphil he has the cases(11,4 x 50R Egyptian) and delivers it start

Regards

Gunner

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Originally Posted by stockerphil

Bought one of these many years ago, might have been from Navy Arms or Ye Olde Hunters Lodge. Would like to be able to shoot it now. Anyone ever shoot one? Think I read the British left the chamber original and made new cartridges up so it could be used as a shotgun. It measures .475 inch at the muzzle and is smooth bored. Will the 577 brass fit the chamber? If so might make a slug gun of it. Can I get a barrel to return it to the original caliber?

Right side of receiver has a Crown. under that is V.R, next line is H.R.B.-Co, next is 1893. under that might be a small crown with an arrow pointing down from it and under that stamped 11.

Does anyone make an insert for this chamber? Maybe I can shoot .410 shotshells through it???

Thanks for any help
Phil

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With those markings it's very unlikely an 11MM anything. Most likely it is simply a 577/450 smoothbore guard gun. Try a 577/450 case in it and see.

Double D,

thanks for the thought. What is a guard gun and why would they make it a smoothbore? I gather it would fire a standard slug?

Any idea where I might get a replacement barrel?

Phil

It's a called a guard gun because, well it's used by guards to guard prisoners and such, it's a shotgun. It shot buck shot and balls.

Good luck finding a barrel. You wouldn't want to change it, the gun is collectable as it is.

Just load up some 577/450 with buckshot and shot it!

Happy new year all.

Special thanks to you Double D and to Gunner, I appreciate the info.

I cast the chamber and it does seem to be a 577 basic. I bought a 577-45 insert adapter from an Alaska company and fired a couple of .410 shells in this Martini. After a couple of shots the breech block no longer closes easily. I'm wondering if the firing pin is caming back during the closing action and might be hitting the steel insert. Do brass cartridges show scraping??? Or is the firing pin camed back on the drop stroke?

It also looks like the chamber rim may have a couple of dents- I'll try a three cornor scrapper to clear them. The barrel may need to be removed to do a clean job. Does it just screw out or is there a cross locking pin of any kind that needs to be removed first?

The locking screw on the left side (cocking lever pivot pin) seems to be stripped and the front bottom center section of the finger lever (the thin part that I guess cams the cocking lever) is torn on both sides, Guess it was forced open too many times. What are the chances of finding replacement parts? Can the lever be welded and reshaped?

Well heading over to the SMLE forum with questions about my 303

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stockerphil

Happy new year all.

I cast the chamber and it does seem to be a 577 basic. I bought a 577-45 insert adapter from an Alaska company and fired a couple of .410 shells in this Martini. After a couple of shots the breech block no longer closes easily. I'm wondering if the firing pin is caming back during the closing action and might be hitting the steel insert. Do brass cartridges show scraping??? Or is the firing pin camed back on the drop stroke?

It also looks like the chamber rim may have a couple of dents- I'll try a three cornor scrapper to clear them. The barrel may need to be removed to do a clean job. Does it just screw out or is there a cross locking pin of any kind that needs to be removed first?

The locking screw on the left side (cocking lever pivot pin) seems to be stripped and the front bottom center section of the finger lever (the thin part that I guess cams the cocking lever) is torn on both sides, Guess it was forced open too many times. What are the chances of finding replacement parts? Can the lever be welded and reshaped?

Well heading over to the SMLE forum with questions about my 303

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Until you fire a 577/450 shot gun shell in the chamber you do not know if you have a problem.

These chamber inserts have a history of problems in Martini chambers.

I have made a good deal of money extracting chamber inserts out of Martini Chambers.

The problem isn't the quality of the inserts. The folks making them, make a high quality top of the line product.

The problem is the Martini chambers; they are non standard. When these guns were made there was no standard shoulder length or shape. The chamber Inserts are made to a fixed standard and the shoulder of the insert can can bump the shoulder of a short chambered original and not allow it to chamber properly.

The other thing I have notices is that the inserts don't seal the chamber that well, again becsasue of the chambers non standard size and when a cartridge is fired gas blows bay and builds carbon in the neck and shoulder preventing the insert from being properly seated in subsequent loadings.

I suggest you get some CBC 24 gauge cases reformed to 577/450 and load them with buck and ball before you decide you need ot fix anything. Thes bass cartridges will porperly seal the chambe when fired.

Replacement Martini lock screws are available from Steve Stonehill at Evans obsolete screws.

I am not sure what you are talking about when you say "front bottom center section of the finger lever (the thin part that I guess cams the cocking lever) is torn on both sides," can you post pictures? Be glad to help.

Here are two pictures. Don't know if I can attach and or if these files are too big. I think this is the lip that cams the cocking lever. In one picture I put the point of a scribe into the crack. There are two cracks, one on each side.

files were too large. Trying again after resizing.

Where can I get cbc 24 gage formed cases? Can I get them loaded?

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Originally Posted by stockerphil

files were too large. Trying again after resizing.

Where can I get cbc 24 gage formed cases? Can I get them loaded?

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The cocking lever is what you have in the picture. It looks like it is broken. If you know what you are doing you could weld it up and fix it. Who knows why it broke. It's over 100 years old.

You can get another from IMA Lever

As to CBC cases post a WTB want to buy here and on the other Martini boards and some one will help you. I have no spares or I would send you a couple.

Thanks, now I can get the parts I need

Appreciate your help

Phil