CMO M1 Carbine Received

Hello All,

Found this forum just in time. I recently ordered a service grade Winchester M1 carbine from CMP in November and they called me last week to see if I wanted a rack grade instead (they were out of service grade). Well it arrived yesterday and I wanted to ask some questions that some of you might be able to help me with. The only marks I could find were:
1. Winchester marked and serial is 1269689. Was this made in 1943 or 1944?
2. Stock is marked "S & C" on the place where the sling fits in the bottom of the rifle.

Since this rifle has been worked and reworked over the years I thougt I would like to see it returned to what is should have looked like when it left the factory over 60 years ago. To this end I wanted to ask some advice. I saw an ad in Shotgun News from a company called James River Armory that will restore your Carbine. Has anyone out there had a Carbine restored by them and were you satisfied? Also it has some type of adjustable rear sight. Should it have a flip sight instead?

Any advice and information about my newest acquistion would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Regards,
Greg

No matter what james river does it will never be just as it was when it left the factory,I would use the term restored loosely, . There is a good chance that most of the parts on your carbine have been switched out and replaced over the years. I think there idea of restoration would be refinishing and re-stamping of parts with fake stamps,or replacing good US parts with fake parts that maybe came from China. I would not expect much for the $300 I saw them advertised for.At best it may look original from ten feet away,I would call it re-creating.Restoration would imply to me replacing with original matching parts that would cost well over $1000, and maybe months of looking for the parts.
You should clean your carbine,shoot your carbine, post pictures of it here and buy yourself a good book about them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GregDLWA

Hello All,
Since this rifle has been worked and reworked over the years I thougt I would like to see it returned to what is should have looked like when it left the factory over 60 years ago. To this end I wanted to ask some advice. I saw an ad in Shotgun News from a company called James River Armory that will restore your Carbine. Has anyone out there had a Carbine restored by them and were you satisfied? Also it has some type of adjustable rear sight. Should it have a flip sight instead?

Any advice and information about my newest acquistion would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Regards,
Greg

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I went to their page:

"Your M1 Carbine will be checked for critical operating areas and we will install a new stock set properly cartouched to your receiver serial number. All metal will be re-parkerized in the original WWII finish. The weapon will then be test fired before returning to you. The cost of this service is $299.00.

You can order these service using our ONLINE STORE or by calling us at 410-242-6991."

All I read is that they are going to put on a new stock, not original, that has been restamped. Again not original. Then repark it. It doesn't mention any other part changes. It will NOT look like it did when it left the factory with early parts. It will look like the rebuilt Carbine you sent to them, just reparked with a bogus stock stamp. And for this they will charge you $300

I think I would shop around a bit. There is a guy on this sight who reparks. Chuckindenver. As for early parts, that could be big dollars.

Good luck,

Jim

This is what I do about replacing parts in my mixmasters. I keep looking for reasonanable deals on parts I want to replace,buy or swap, ebay,forums,gun shows,flea markets.etc.Once I find a replacement part[original] that I think is a reasonable deal and get it I sell or trade the parts I replace at a fair price. So far in the last yr I have made an Inland and Underwood 95% correct manuf. parts at little cost to me. Just keep looking. A lot of parts are cheaper buying direct than on ebay,Gunbroker is exspensive most of the time.I hope this helps.Merry Christmas to all!

You might want to buy an inexpensive paperback, "US M1 Carbines, Wartime Production" by Craig Riesch. When you have your first carbine, it makes for interesting reading, & allows you to understand why "parts" are so important in determining what you actually have. According to Mr Riesch, Sprague & Carleton was a WW2 stock supplier; although they don't list your exact marking, it's a fair bet your stock is a replacement made by this company. It's certainly a more authentic stock than the "FAT" Italian stocks that come on some recent CMP carbines.

But, I have to go with the guys: Repark your carbine, & it will be even further away from it's original US Military configuration. Leave it as is, & enjoy owning & shooting it.

Neal

"I yam what I yam." ----- Popeye

Greg,
You say you can see the letters S C in the slingwell. Look closer to see if there isn't a B after the S C markings.
Sounds as if you may have a Sprague & Carleton stock.
I know they were the first and only WWII maker to use Birch for Carbine stocks, mainly used on IBM carbines.
Look very closely on the rightside for a small....almost nickel sized Crossed Cannons Stamp.

Pictures Please......

Charlie-painter777

Painter, I hate to tell you this, but they were NOT the only ones to use Birch. I have a very nice NPM with an original Birch stock that was made by Trimble Nursery.

Pictures of stock can be seen at the below. It is a S. & C. marked stock.



M1 Carbine pictures by GregDLWA - Photobucket

JimB,
Can you pass a picture of that TN stock along to me via E-mail?

THX
Merry Christmas
Charlie

A S&C stock with the bomb,
2nd I've seen.
War time replacement?

Charlie-painter777

I have found no reference to S&C making war time or post war replacement stocks. S&C are listed by Riesch as the only ones to use Birch and only for IBM. As to being the only ones to use Birch I have wondered about that sometimes.

I ordered a National Postal Meter service grade carbine in mid November. Around Dec 1, I saw that they were not showing service grade for sale anymore. A day or so later, I received the E-mail from CMP that they had received my order. I'm just hoping that means that I just slid in under the wire but I guess I'll just wait and see what happens.

HI Greg,

Have you taken it out to shoot it yet?