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I was wondering if anyone could help? I am looking into the history of my two L42a1’s, and the associated markings on the transit cases. I’m trying to trace the regiments they would belong to. I was looking on the following website, in one of the pictures the transit case has "W.T." can any one decode this? What dose it mean? as it is on one of my cases. many thanks :sos:
http://www.armetec.fr/docs-armes/arm...site-1355.html
I'll take a guess at Weapon Training (dismissing the obvious alternative of Wireless Telegraphy)
Wt is WEIGHT, as in pounds and ounces. It is an indication for the loadmaster when weighing up freight for aircraft.
You could have a box that big to carry a 1 pound weight of highly delicate and accurate calibration equipment. Or a large steel cross head slide for a milling machine. Same size but...........
Interesting Rifle, first I have seen that has had the rear pad removed at one time.
Many thanks guys!! Peter if “WT” is an indication of weight of the transit case then “Box 22” and “S 4/7”, could relate to shipping consignment numbers? Also what would the significance of the Yellow (Left hand side), and Blue (Right hand side) of the chest unit markings? As mine is Yellow (Left hand side), and Red (Right hand side).
Ain't got a clue! 4/7 = 4th/7th Dragoon Guards but I doubt it. But the Horseys go in for that gaudy paint stuff
These are all typical unit markings. E.g. each of the rifle/support companys in an infantry battalion would probably have some sort of paint colour code on its items of equipment - everything from bergans to cooking equipment.
When a UK unit moves by air/sea/rail, all vehicles and boxed equipment usually requires shipping information: weight, item number against manifest, number of items, chalk/load/pallet number, etc.
"Box 22" probably refers to the last time it was shipped as part of a unit stores (before it eventually got backloaded to depot and disposed of). "S 4/7" could be a rifle list number, eg "sniper set No4 out of 7 total" (about right for a company holding), or it could be a divisional tac number that identifies the sub-unit.
Thanks Thunderbox I understand that the one with the Yellow/Red markings is from the Irish Guards as part of 5 Coy, this is the one with “S 4/7” on it and “Box 22”. The other Transit Case has a well-worn coating of green paint all over, with “WT” with the Black box pained below; this has Red paint on the left and right sides of the box.
There are markings on the right hand side of the box; there is a sticky label with a metal holder brass I think? This has a green spot in the left hand corner, and it say on it “PRI 13 OF 112 MAIN HQ VA with WT in the bottom left of the sticker, under that is DON-3 088244”. On the left hand side of the box, there is a printed label on it is printed. Top left “194 OF 204 S below DONNINGTON – ABINGDON” this label is very torn. Although the Donnington bit is very worn, and you can only just make out the Abingdon.
Central Ordnance Depot Donnington stores a great many items for the Army. It has mysteriously caught fire at least twice in recent years.
My late father was involved in setting fire to the (much depleted by black market sales) stores at Kai Tak in 1946 after it was announced that auditors were coming out from England to take stock of what had already been written off for the projected invasion of Malaya.
Maybe some owners can post information and pictures on the chests that they have? If there’s no reference material for these chests, I guess a link like this will help others.
:beerchug:Quote:
Originally Posted by DanL96a1
A good place to start would be to check the 1971 L42A1 Enfield Sniper Rifle (click here), located in the England - Milsurp Knowledge Library (click here)
Regards,
Badger
Badger thank you for the information on the L42A1, I have looked at this and found it VERY informative. I have had a bit of luck today in getting some information, on my two chests. After a liberal use of nail varnish remover, (much to the disapproval of my girlfriend) I have found the original unit markings of the rifles on the box. And after some phone calls, and research I have come up with some answers.
Chest 1 (Box 22 & S 4/7)
Was part of 5 Coy Irish Guards, and was part of the HDCC. Possibly used as an pool rifle, as part of the ATR Snipers Instructors Courses
Chest 2. (WT and covered in green paint)
Was part of D Coy 3 Queens Reg, which is now 3 PWRR. This was sent back to HQ Coy and seems to have seen out service there with little use.
I have only started to unravel the history, but that’s what I got so far! Dose anyone have the UIT number for 5 Coy Irish Guards, and D Coy 3 Queens Regiment? Peter L do you have a picture of the CES, inside the L42 transit case lid. As all the ones I have tracked down, have had them removed (most likely taken out at the time the green slings, were moved to the L96’s).
What exactly is the UIT number you refer to? There won't be a UIN (the unique or unit identification number) for what you ask because the UIN only relates to the UNIT and not sub-sections or sub units.
Do you mean the CES or just the CES stick-on LABEL? I'm sure someone out there has had them copied but the original ones were, if I remember correctly, scratch engraved on laminated plastic and there was a format to remanufacture in the old EMER's. But Sooooo time consuming.......
Peter you are correct as always, it is UIN not UIT. I have an “A” number like A012 on the second chest but cannot make it out perfectly… was advised that this might be a UIN, (Sorry for the confusion big fingers, and fast typing never a good idea!). I thought I could use the UIN, to cross reference current information relating to the chest.
In regards the CES it’s the sticky label, placed inside the lid. I have only ever seen one at XXXXXXXX, which was placed next to the black L42A1 label. From my memory it was hand scribbled… but if there is a correct layout, I would be interested to have a look at a template. Any other information and pictures, in regards to this would be very much appreciated. If they are engraved on to plastic, you could point me in the right direction I could get these done to mil specs?
My L42 chest is in OD. Nothing else on exterior. Interior has only an affixed label detailing content. The construction is much heavier than my "T" cases. regards, GaryQuote:
Originally Posted by DanL96a1
Just out of interested and deviating away from the tread of this link, I found the following link on the “trails” brackets for the L42A1. This link also has an, interesting view of the No.32 telescopes found on the No.4 (T).
No.32 Mk.3 Link
http://news.webshots.com/album/140798078vePtgd
L42A1 Trails Bracket Link
http://news.webshots.com/album/561076316PZmBhs
Never knew they fitted the Art II scope on the L42. But then I fitted the Kalinka PSOP to the FAL. inch or metric. using the Williams QD pro mount. Performs well in semi auto. . GaryQuote:
Originally Posted by DanL96a1
I don't think 'they' did Arado. I think HE did (I mean the author of the news webshot article) ! The ART was a non starter due to its technical nature that far, far, exceeded anything that was required or could be absorbed by the sniper. I'd call it 'imaginative'............
Jane's Infantry Weapons from about 1977-1980 had a picture of an ART scope mounted on a No 4. (I don't remember if the exact variant could be identified- the caption just read that the rifle was NOT an M21.)
[Acknowledgement to whoever first posted these pics years back...]
Looks like someone tinkered with an ART on an Envoy. Not sure if these were ever built or even if they were a military/Enfield venture at all. The one or two two hybrid rifles I've come across all lead back to a former private dealer in London.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...90752703-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...90752701-1.jpg
I have read in the website http://www.amstevens.fsnet.co.uk on the Enforcer, that they originally played with an Envoy and Pecar telescopic sight, before they came up with the Enforcer. But I was not aware of the Envoy and ART silenced version being “tinkered” with.
I was lead to believe the trails telescope was a Leatherwood, which was placed against the No.32 in the 60’s & 70’s (Page 103-104 An Armourers Perspective). The “trails” bracket was made for these trials, for use on the L42A1. I don’t know the user of news.webshots, but found it and thought I was interesting.
As a mater of interest the development of the leatherwood ART, was shown on page 296 of (Out of Nowhere history of the military sniper). May be the imaginative user of news.webshots saw this? I understand they tinkered with the (Green S&B L1A1), with the SAS bracket used in the 90’s with the L42A1 as a fill in to aid the L96A1.(Ian Skennerton’s British Empire Sniper Rifles SAIS No.22 ).
Nice Pictures of the L42A1 CES.
http://imageevent.com/willyp/firearm...sniperriflekit
I know this is a tall order, but I want to build a couple of L 42 transit boxes, anyone have a set of blueprints for the box?
The L42 Photos thread had some "L42 chests" and some close ups of the external markings and interiors etc
L42 Photos - Military Surplus Collectors Forums
Pictures of L42 labels on the ends of the chest. Looks like bar codes were used at some point.
Hmmm, these bar codes are interesting, wonder what they would translate into?? Bar codes where introduced only so long ago. this L 42 you have coldzero, what year was it made? By the way, did you enjoy the Calgary gun show?
These barcodes are the Donnington identifiers. They will contain the NATO part number, the serial number and location codes. They were in use when the L42's were disposed of
Calgary was great fun!Quote:
Originally Posted by grant580