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Well, I'd say they really didn't go away, but I was really surprised to find that an old link still went to their web site, and lo, its been growing and looking better than ever since I last looked.
Looks like we're going to see them around for a good bit longer, 'I'd have one...or two, or:D
AIA - Australian International Arms
http://www.australianinternationalarms.com.au/
Gday, that site hasnt changed for a bit over 12 months, I wish they would update it more regularly!, but all the same its a great spot to learn a bit about them. Hope you get hold of an AIA soon!
Cheers Adam
I wish they'd get a US distibutor. I understand all the where with all why they don't, their ability to supply and demand filling their production w/o this market anyway, but they are well built, tight rifles. I want one of their L-42 clones!
I'd like one of the 7.62x39s just for something a bit different. Plus, rapid fire practice wouldn't eat up valuable .303 SAA.
Like this?
.
.
.
(sorry, couldn't help myself) :lol:
Well now you have to do an extensive field test,
and do a no holes bared wright up for the rest of us.
please,
Thats a nice looking rifle.
I bought a B2 yesterday and took it to the range today and its a very good shooter. I took a kicking though and have a nice bruise to prove it. With practice I will be able to shoot MOA or better.
It has a brass butt plate that looks really nice but is held on with two flathead screws and the heads protrude a little. I think thats what beat me up and not usually shooting anything bigger than a 5.56.
Repeat after me 5 times ...Quote:
Originally Posted by limpetmine
AIA Rifles will never be imported into the US again.
AIA Rifles will never be imported into the US again.
AIA Rifles will never be imported into the US again.
AIA Rifles will never be imported into the US again.
AIA Rifles will never be imported into the US again.
The last batch that went to the US was a over sight by the State Department, cause the paperwork said "Made in Australia" but before the 2nd batch came in the State Department found they were actually made in Vietnam. That is when the State Department stopped them from entering the country. Plus the fact AIA was a pain in the butt to deal with per the distributors. If you search the various forums at about that time frame you'll find posts from the distributors on this subject.
Likelyhood AIA rifles will be allowed in after they pooched the paperwork to the State Department is what you think? :nono:
Dimitri
Nothing is impossible. All it might take is granting the Viet's MFN status, and their in. We are trading with them now, check out the innertubes for lawn mowers at Home Depot.
No ITAR items to or from Vietnam under any condition, same as North Korea, Iran, etc
Dimitri
Items from Viet Nam are not restricted. But they do not get favorable status either. The problem is the U.S. State Department. The importers have to jump through a LOT of hoops(some very expensive) that only one attempted to import. They got slapped with so many extra charges, fees and regulations, they went out of business. By the time someone could get the AIA guns imported, they would have to charge a 500% margin just to break even, and NOBODY would be willing to pay that much for one of their guns.
That is why you probably will not see them in the U.S. anytime soon.
To the best of my knowledge the STOCK is made in Vietnam nothing else. I was told by Kyle from AIA that they were NEVER paid by the distributor in the USA. AIA had the guns seized and the person "holding" the guns sold them and again AIA was never paid. I wouldn't send any to the USA again either. Kyle said in his email to me they lost all their money in every gun they shipped into the US. I would post the email I was sent by AIA but promised not to do that as it included the new pricing and they are going to be very expensive. I like jmoore would like a 7.62 X 39 as the ammo is so cheap. It is also strange that so many people bring up Vietnam, gee look at all we buy from China, anyone remember KOREA??
ITAR regs ban military items such as firearms from going to or from Vietnam. Other goods are fine just not firearms, tanks, fighter planes, bombs, ammunition, missiles, explosives etcQuote:
Originally Posted by jona
The magazines when compared to made in Vietnam M14 magazines appear to be the same. Barrels were supposedly sourced through Vietnam at one point from US left behind. The receiver manufacturing location has not been determined other then (as of the US importation problems) the registered Aussie address is not it. Which per the Australian Business registry has changed a handful of times.Quote:
Originally Posted by enfield303t
Dimitri
Funny I keep reading about "US importation problems" but have never had that confirmed by anyone, just rumours. AIA informed me they are going to make 500 rifles in 2010 and if you ever hear of them exporting to the USA again please let me know as I want to witness "Hell Freezing Over".
The following is an actual question given on a University of Washington chemistry mid-term.Quote:
Originally Posted by enfield303t
The answer by one student was so "profound" that the professor shared it with colleagues, via the Internet, which is, of course, why we now have the pleasure of enjoying it as well:
Bonus Question: Is Hell exothermic (gives off heat) or endothermic (absorbs heat)?
Most of the students wrote proofs of their beliefs using Boyle's Law (gas cools when it expands and heats when it is compressed) or some variant.
One student, however, wrote the following:
First, we need to know how the mass of Hell is changing in time. So we need to know the rate at which souls are moving into Hell and the rate at which they are leaving. I think that we can safely assume that once a soul gets to Hell, it will not leave. Therefore, no souls are leaving. As for how many souls are entering Hell, let's look at the different religions that exist in the world today. Most of these religions state that if you are not a member of their religion, you will go to Hell. Since there is more than one of these religions and since people do not belong to more than one religion, we can project that all souls go to Hell. With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number of souls in Hell to increase exponentially. Now, we look at the rate of change of the volume in Hell because Boyle's Law states that in order, for the temperature and pressure in Hell to stay the same, the volume of Hell has to expand proportionately as souls are added.
This gives two possibilities:
1. If Hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls enter Hell, then the temperature and pressure in Hell will increase until all Hell breaks loose.
2. If Hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in
Hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until Hell freezes over.
So which is it?
If we accept the postulate given to me by Teresa during my freshman year that, "It will be a cold day in Hell before I sleep with you," and take into account the fact that I slept with her last night, then number two must be true, and thus I am sure that Hell is exothermic and has already frozen over. The corollary of this theory is that since Hell has frozen over, it follows that it is not accepting any more souls and is therefore is extinct......leaving only Heaven, thereby proving the existence of a divine being which explains why, last night, Teresa kept shouting "Oh my God."
THIS STUDENT RECEIVED THE ONLY "A
Which AIA rifles were made in Vietnam??? As far as i know, none were. If you have an AIA rifle, AIA will always respond to your emails. In fact Kyle Hadley, the head of quality control, will help with absolutley anything. I am sending mine (14 of 25 prototype *T M10's) back to Brisbane for a bedding upgrade, and a new stock and forend. In fact, Ive ordered a repro L42a1 spec transit case to house it all as well.
A portion of the US buyers market is a bit miffed, and rightly so! They are missing out on a fine line of rifles. Ive seen many negative forum postings around the traps, all seemingly nothing to do with the quality of the build, or performance of these rifles, but with AIA's communication skills. If you read some of the AIA website, you may find that they state themselves, that they develop and build quality weapons, they do not manage websites or do PR. You must deal with a Distributor for sales. The American market, as big and illustrious as it is, doesnt affect the sales of their product. The aussie domestic market gobbles them up very quickly, as they are 100% Australian made, low build numbered quality items. The recievers are all milled in Brisbane, the barrels are all hand lapped and the woodwork is all done by hand, on an individual rifle basis in Brisbane. I have seen articles in Australian shooters magazines of the production facilitys IN BRISBANE!
The Teak used on stocks, is sourced from Vietnam, New Guinea, or any other rainforest rich tropical islands in the Pacific that grow old dense Teak nativley.The US canned the import of these rifles partly because of the timber componentry made form Vietnamese wood, NOT BECAUSE ITS A VIETNAMESE MADE RIFLE.
Really that is an insult to the AIA team, as they have been developing and building very good rifles for close to a decade. Technical skills that rival many much larger allegedly professional overseas engineering companies.
Ive seen new $3000 Remingtons that have needed "some adjustment to bolt fit" and "just a tiny bit of inletting" etc etc. Not with an AIA rifle.
If I sound biased its because I am!. Great rifle!
This isnt at anyone in particular just my rant on the AIA subject. Thanks!
Any chance of sharing the details of the production houses from the magazine articles?Quote:
Originally Posted by powdermonkey72
I'm afraid I've seen plenty of words very similar to yours, but I've never seen anything that convinces me they are any more than assembled in Brisbane.
Ok, straight from their current website at http://www.australianinternationalar...au/history.htm
"Development and manufacture of the A.I.A. rifles is truly international. Like many other military and commercial production rifles today, many component parts and work is outsourced. This varies between the models and is largely dependent upon availability and quality. No nylon, plastic or alloy are used in our rifles, just good old-fashioned steel and hardwood, along with the new technology.
Rifles are currently prepared in Queensland, Australia, from local and imported component parts or groups. All screws, pins and springs are made in Australia and each rifle is hand-fitted and tested, unlike most production today.
Wood furniture has come from the United States, Brazil, New Guinea, West Africa and Laos. It has been profiled in Australia and in Vietnam."
Hmmm, seems to me if they were making receivers in Aus they'd be mentioning them ahead of the springs, pins and screws.
Quote:
Originally Posted by powdermonkey72
Well, they haven't responded to any of mine!
See that right there? No alloy used? :yikes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Son
I guess they must be using pure Iron to make the rifles. But we know that is not the case. The AIA group as a whole is good at lieing nothing technical though, because up until after they were imported into Canada and the US they were claiming the rifles were completely built in Australia. And statements like above show they are not competent enough to build a dog house never mind a firearm.
The original US distributors did issue at the time public statements on various web forums that the State Department found the rifles to be made in Vietnam. If you dig deep in American boards you can find them, I believe the FAL Files was one such board.
Dimitri
Sorry, I should of typed..."if you own an AIA rifle, in Australia...
Hmmm, I wonder if there was oil in those rifles? Why else would the US State Department make up such lies!Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimitri
....said with tonque firmly in cheek, gents, :o but you can bet someone will suggest it's all part of a great conspiracy! :nono:
well, it would seem, it doesnt matter what is said, people who dont actually own these rifles will probably keep the "great debate" alive and well.
I also agreed that i would not post correspondance from AIA on any forums, and havent yet and do not intend to. Thier word is good enough as their work is impeccable. The arguments always seem to smack of jealousy, bit tedious to be honest. I may be wrong, i dont really care. As I said , im going on what I was told.
and just let me say, the ferver in which this topic is discussed by naysayers, never ceases to amaze me...
happy shooting dimitri.
limpetmine, maybe they haven't responded to your email knowing you paid for your rifle but they believe they were never paid for the rifle.:rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by limpetmine
Let me quote the email from AIA..."AFTER THEY NEVER PAID US FOR SHIPMENTS---NOT EVEN THE FREIGHT'
The old saying "once bitten" comes to mind and lets face it they really don't care about the American Market, they are too small of a company and personally I could give a Rats ### where they are made they are just a great rifle..
Quote:
Originally Posted by powdermonkey72
As you have probably observed, quite a few here have differing views on the topic. Most have already agreed to disagree, but I think it fair to say almost all would be open to hear any new information whichever way it went.
The thread was started by someone genuinely excited by the prospect of the rifles being available in NZ. I hope everyone gets what they want from the builders (their term) of these rifles, including unhappy customers still waiting for answers to questions asked years ago. The important thing for you is your rifle does what it should... The important thing for me is that they are not Lee Enfields, and are but a passing interest here on a collectors forum.
No, I wouldn´t say that they´re just a "passing interest" nor that they aren´t Enfields. They certainly are not (yet) collectors´ items but not all of us are collectors. We should be grateful that a manufacturer has kept Enfields alive and furnished proof that the basic design is NOT just history.
Totally agree with you villiers, I think sometime in the future many people are going to wish they had bought one, I think the "nay sayers" will be some of the first! I am not trying to be pro AIA but after seeing two and shooting one they are very well made and great to shoot. It does seem rather strange that the biggest complainers about them have never even handled, owned or shot one. :bash:Quote:
Originally Posted by villiers
They can be found in Skennertons latest enfield history, i had my brand new, unopened copy stolen, it was in my car at the time, which was also a bother seeing as how they took the car as well. I really would not have minded if theyd thrown the book out on the ground, and just taken the ute.
I hadnt even opened the post pack it was sent in....If any one that could be bothered, would be kind enough to have a quick look, id be greatfull.
If not, ill have a look when i get my next copy...
Cheers
Jeez, there's some rotten sods about, taking a blokes rifle book, and the ute too! Are the dog, the beers and the missus where ya left them?Quote:
Originally Posted by powdermonkey72
BTW, I just was looking at the AIA spread showing all their rifles and just noticed that all seem to have only a simple L shaped battle type rear sight. I suppose one could say scopes are really whats intended but a poor rear sight on a rifle is always disappointing to see. I am a big fan of the enfield no1 sight from 1905, now thats a sight with some proper adjustments!
The fancy ladder sights were probably the single most expensive parts of the rifle, originally. On some types of weapons they cost up to 20-30% of the entire unit price! Thus, they're often one of the first things to go...
Never mind that lot, what about the rifles??:DQuote:
Originally Posted by RJW NZ
And Dimitri, "alloy" is Australian for "aluminium" or "aluminium alloy".
Why dump on the only people who've made the effort to improve, update and otherwise keep current the Enfield action?
So some bits are made in Vietnam? Good, they're not a communist state anymore. Should we not buy something made in what was East Germany for example?
I'd love to have a No4 with a chrome-lined NOS Minigun barrel myself!
Humm its still very much a single party communist state. Not too sure what Vietnam your talking about. :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Surpmil
CIA - The World Factbook -- Vietnam
Vietnam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Communist Party of Vietnam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Dimitri
Quote:
Originally Posted by Son
In actual fact they ARE a Lee-Enfield variant, and, due to their limited production, are likely to be quite collectable.
They just aren't a MILITARY L-E, nor are they old, ....yet.
I'd happily disallow their discussion on this particular forum when you also disallow:
Parker Hale and other aftermarket sights
BSA et al. commercially produced L-Es
Non-military rebuilds
Police issue weapons such as Enforcers
Let's NOT even begin w/ VZ58s, AKs, AR platforms, Springfield Armory Inc. anything, etc.
Otherwise, if you've no interest, don't read!:p;)
Ok, you missed what I said- it's in your quote from me posted above... "for me...."Quote:
Originally Posted by jmoore
By your definition (?) they are Lee Enfields. By my definition they were not made for military service at either a Government Small Arms Factory, or at a private sector factory under either a contract for military rifles or a licence to produce sporting rifles based on the design. Lee Enfields!
The other bits you mention are mostly accessories, bling.
No problem here, just our baselines are drawn in different spots, that's all.:beerchug:
If there's a problem there, lets talk about it in twenty years or so when they become collectables :thup:
just a thought, if a No4 is a Lee Enfield (Lee design, basically, Enfield improved/ produced) shouldn't the AIA rifles be Lee Brisbanes :rofl:
Cheers,
Brad.
Well, OK, then! Lee-Brisbanes! Gonna get confusing, though.... (LB vs L-B)
Ummm, If its a licensing thing, then I think, technically, No.4s aren't really a L-E either just an -E. Hence my contention, its a Lee derivative. (W/ features stolen from Enfield- Hey, maybe Enfield ought to sue...!!!!):lol:
Yep, you make a good point, but who are they gonna sue? :dunno: The Lee Brisbanes are truly a dispersal rifle, the component makers are scattered all aver the globe. :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by jmoore
This forum has really turned into some great fun in my opinion and as most of you know I think the AIA rifles are great. If I hadn't bought a P17 and a No 4 T with all the goodies in the last week I would have one on order right now. Was going to order but cancelled as I just spent too many $$$$$$$$$$$$$ this week on my hobby. Will probably change my mind on spending today as I am going to the Gun Show in Kamloops and IF I can keep my wallet in my pocket will probably order a AIA from Marstar next week. Gotta get a AIA and if anyone ever moves to Canada and is allowed to bring a AIA in 7.62 X 39 PLEASE contact me as that is what I really want.
I agree with Son, the AIA rifles are re-engineered modern reproductions of a classic rifle and no matter how hard you try to make it look good it just doesn't compare to the original item no matter how hard you try and pretty it up.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/deleted.gif
I might understand someone in Australia drinking too much O.P. Bundy and getting confused and buying one but that is still not an excuse for buying a forgery.
Both Son and I prefer the classic Enfield Lithgows even with their variety of stocking up methods.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../Page06a-1.jpg
Forgive me if I'm out of touch on the current poltical scene there. (Educate us by all means) My impression was they are going "capitalist" in a hurry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimitri
Let me rephrase that then, I'd feel no worse about having a rifle (partly?) made in Vietnam than I would one made in China - and you know how many of those are around these days - not that I own any.
As you can imagine, given the rather silly laws in various countries, AIA probably have to play their cards rather close to their chests. I don't blame them for that.
I assume that in the interests of moral consistency you don't own any weapons made in say, Nazi Germany or Soviet Russia?
I'm just happy Mr. Lee's design is still "alive" and in production in some form. My initial attraction to the rifle came not from its history but from its function/ergonomics. (Horrors to some, I'm sure!) Aside from brute strength issues and benchrest accuracy potential, the package still seems to me the best fighting turnbolt rifle ever developed.
"Poo-poo"-ing a current production version is like a '98 Mauser fan complaining about Zatava/Remington 798s. So what if its no longer military? Be happy some folk thought enough of the design to go the the LARGE trouble of making new ones for "regular" folk. If you can't have a new semiauto center fire rifle, what would your choice be for a rough and tumble weapon, esp. if you face the possibility of being away from "civilization" for a length of time? Some folk LIKE "new".
I salute AIA for doing something so "stupid"! I hope they sell hundreds of thousands of 'em.
Heck, they ought to come up w/ a trim little sporter that makes Bubba trade in the L-E he was a'fixin' to cut up, as some nutty collector will actually pay money for that "old clunker".
There would be little point in AIA making an exact copy of a #4. It would be competing directly with all the British, Canadian and Savage made #4s. The heavy receiver is an improvement for anyone wanting to use the 7.62 NATO AND A SCOPE. I think it would make a great 5.56mm to play with. It is for sure an original can't offer that.
You don't see guys talking about new Remchesters on a Mauser collectors forum.
Forgery they are not improved copy yes. Check your dictionary guys. Some folk like to use a certain type of rifle, they do wear out break dowm etc finding parts for 50yr + rifles is becoming harder. Then there is that ten shot box. NINE out of TEN to AIA they forgot the bayonet lugs and the charger clip slot but then that could be called forgery so TEN out of TEN.
The receiver and accuracy seemed pretty good with the L42. Consistent hits on a Hun-head target at 1000m is about 1MOA accuracy.Quote:
Originally Posted by ireload2
As for 5.56, I've heard of a gent doing extensive testing of an SMLE in 5.56mm. He used the more flexible receiver of the No1 as compared to the No4 to attempt to duplicate the well-known "compensation" of the No4 in .303 and 7.62mm, which made the rifle such a force in long range competition particularly.
Difference between a "right wing" monarchy, and a "left wing" communist that replaced the first? That the first one does not hide the fact its there to make a dollar while the latter does it under the guise that its "for the people", They are all capitalists. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Surpmil
Actually I don't. Belgium, Canada, England, and the US are represented in my gun collection. Mind you with our interest in surplus arms, buying a firearm from such a country originally, does not support them directly or indirectly anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Surpmil
Since it seems that for some reason people get "hung-up" on the thought of buying something from a "communist country" I guess those people have never bought or owned a car, hammer, saw, egg timer, plastic pail or anything plastic, toys, plastic grocery bag, pen, pencil, coaxial cable, mobile phone, shirt, pants, ties, socks, sport shoes heck I could write for the next month on items made in "communist countries" we use every day. Now to really set this off Vietnam is getting very popular as a source for many items as with some products China is getting too expensive! Very soon China will be replaced by Vietnam for thousands of everyday products. If you are not willing to buy a gun then you shouldn't buy ANYTHING as no matter what you buy you are supporting the "regime".
I had two Chevrolet's made in a country with a socialist medical care system and they seldom broke. But if they did get sick and break I just took them across the border and the and they were fixed for free. :madsmile:
The difference between Communism and Capitalism is very simple......
Under Communism "man exploits man" and under Capitalism its just the other way around. ;)
Don't tell Son, but I secretly would like to have an AIA in .308/7.62, but they cost too much and besides I would never find out if my 2A1 was going to blow up by shooting it with Capitalistic commercial .308 ammo in a rifle made in a primarily Hindu country. (firearms profiling)
And at least my "copies" were made in China and Romania. :rolleyes:
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...04/skeak-1.jpg
And look at the bright side, at least these AIA rifles weren't made by Hobbits. :yikes:
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo..._nz_lotr-1.gif
I'll ask the BATFE Chief of the Firearms Technology Branch next weekend at SAR East in York, PA if they're importable to the USA. We've heard all the hearsay, lets find out the facts. I'll report back and if the response is positive, I'll be glad to bring them in for any potential buyers. If they turn me down; well, it won't be the first time and probably not the last!
Yup, time to revive the CAC...they probably still have the 303 dies someplace, and god knows we need a good cheap supply of 303. :move eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Horton
Ed i wont tell Son if you keep mine. I will be able to tell you secrets about 51s and 39s soon:D:beerchug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Edward Horton
You can avoid most of the goods you mentioned and by North American, Western European etc easily if your willing to spend a extra dollar.Quote:
Originally Posted by enfield303t
Heck bought myself a dinner wear set all made in the US for a mere 10% more the the Chinese one beside it when I first got my own place.
Dimitri