I have had several of these but always with the goofy red grips. You guys ever seen one with black grips? Doug
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I have had several of these but always with the goofy red grips. You guys ever seen one with black grips? Doug
Not that common in the UK; all the later examples I have seen for the EM-2 project had been in black.Quote:
Originally Posted by Douglas Kerley
From memory the grip material had the commercial name of "Tufnel", can anybody confirm this please?
I've got a couple of the black grip version.
The material was called PAXOLIN. It was a linen impregnated variant of tufnol that was a bit more pliable, easy to mould but difficult (?) to machine.
There was talk of using it to mould L1A1 handguards in the early/mid 60's. It even got to the trials stage but the laminated ply versions were the quickest out of the blocks
Any idea of the ebay value? This one is missing a grip screw. Is that screw common with any other type and or available anywhere? The screw is parkerized gray. Took one off a Lithgow No1 bayonet and it is perfect but a little long. I just ordered a scabbard from Sarco for $9.95. Doug
Some of the No7 bayos actually came with cut down P13/14/17 scabbards, painted green. I have one of each. The red handled one has a metal scabbard and the black handled one has the leather/metal scabbard. At first I thought some one had bubbaed a scabbard but it is correct.
Weird. Yeah, I would figure it was Bubbaed too. Thought the green ones were the US ones. I'll just stick with the cheapie metal one. I just hate knives with out scabbards. Thanks. Doug
EM-2 Project? Wow? That's really far out of the box. Didn't figure those for a bayonet at all. Thanks Love the Nome De Gurre. Right out of Kipling? Doug
As a matter of interest, they were NEVER issued from UK Military Ordnance with cut down scabbards of any description. It came with the SCABBARD, bayonet, No5 Mk1 or the Mk2 version
Both my red and black handled versions came with the No5 Mk1 scabbard. I need to repaint one as the scabbard was quite rusty so I removed all the rust and now its too chrome like!
Thanks Peter, I should have checked out that information on the cut down further. I've seen others with the same set up. I will look further into it as I also remember a pic of the combination. Maybe it was on an EE.
I checked a few sites and there is no mention of the cut down scabbard on any of them.
Thanks again
all right, check out collectorssource.ca
They have the same scabbard on a No7 bayonet I'm talking about. They call it a No7L Land Use. That's a new one on me too. They have a couple of others there as well. They also have pics of what they sell
collectorssource.ca says," Lee Enfield No. 7 bayonet, Black Handle, with frog, BA323 $295.00
Add to Cart
No. 7 bayonets with black handle are uncommon and were used for dress or parade use by specific regiments. This one is EXC condition and includes wide web frog coloured white." Comments? Thanks Doug
The black and brown paxolin grips were issued under the same part number and it really was just pot luck as to whatever colour came through the Ordnance system. It was nothing to do with whatever unit they were issued to....the UK Military really doesn't work like that!
The No5 bayonet grips were another good example. You got boxes of left side one-hole grips and two-hole right side grips and vice verca because the part/stock number was the same. You just had to match them up. It was OK when thimgs were plentiful but when times were hard and spares short, you just patched up the wood grips and made do.
Black No7 grips might be more scarce outside in civilian life but in the service, while there were less, they certainly weren't rare by any means.
There was a bit of a myth that the black early 80's eye caps for the L42 were a special issue for Marines................ NOT so. Just another batch that came into the system, allowing a manufacturer to make the best use of his materials.
The pics didn't come with it but if you go to their site there is a pic. Note first item of 3 and prices.
Mine obviously isn't the only one set up like this. Is there any reason for this to happen? Besides being the work of bubba? The French cut down a lot of P17 scabbards and bayonets to make crude fighting knives, is this a possibility, or was the British system rigid about their issue?
Lee Enfield No. 7 bayonet $235.00 Add to Cart
British No. 7 Mark 1/L, for LAND USE. For Lee Enfield No. 4 Rifle, rotating red fibre bakelite handle. Shortened Pattern 1907 steel mounted leather scabbard. VG+
BA 238 Lee Enfield No. 7 bayonet, BA238 $205.00 Add to Cart
British No. 7 Mark 1/L, for LAND USE. For Lee Enfield No. 4 Rifle, rotating red fibre bakelite handle, steel scabbard. VG condition with traces of original military black paint. EXC condition scabbard
BA 323 Lee Enfield No. 7 bayonet, Black Handle, with frog, BA323 $295.00 Add to Cart
No. 7 bayonets with black handle are uncommon and were used for dress or parade use by specific regiments. This one is EXC condition and includes wide web frog coloured white.
Anybody want to trade one of these for Axis or Central Powers stuff I like? Mine is excellent, unsharpened, but maybe 5% staining on the blade. Doug
The very reason why the No7 and No9 bayonets were sold scabbardless is because we kept them to use with the L1A1 bayonets that were replacing them. In much the same way as the leather Grenade Launcher frogs were scarce....., because they were retained for use with the L1A1 rifle grenade launcher and when the new webbing came out, with a small pocket for it, they languished in quartermaster stores and were then scrapped locally!
Anyway, that's the reason why the big retailers try to sell you these bayonets with cut down SMLE and other scabbards. It's a load a bxxxxxxs. No7 and 9 bayonets only come with No5 scabbards
If I remember rightly, there were two sorts of scabbard. The Mk1 variant that was made on cycle frame rolling machinery that needed a small oval end to be brazed in place. I won't go into why, but.............. And the much later 50's era Mk2 type that was hot rolled all the way down and didn't need an end stopper. There was also two types of mouthpiece. The brass and folded steel type. The 6BA hole in the steel version would strip easily and so was immediately unserviceable but the stripped brass version was brazed over, redrilled and re-tapped
There, another useless bit of Lee Enfield rubbish.
Not Useless Information! You were there. You saw it in operation. Who would know better that you of the minutia of this stuff? I am deep into the minutia of the Axis and Central Power stuff. I always found it weird that all Japanese T30 bayonets fit on all weapons from 1897 to 1945 but all scabbards did not fit on all bayonets.
Anybody got a clue as to what these markings are supposed to be and mean? Thanks Doug
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
I guess that nobody does. Nobody here wants this either. So, off to Ebay. Last hour of the auction and it's up to $170. 35 watchers 18 bids We will see what the last min. snipers come up with. Sarco sent me two pig sticker spikes with scabbards instead of the scabbards for these I ordered. I called them and asked about the scabbards and they said that they had them and would ship them to me when I returned the dumb spikes. They would not allow me to buy two scabbards and have them sent out next day and just have the money reposted to my account when they got the return back. I give up. I'll just talk it out with the winner.
Anybody got an extra No.1 Mk3 1907 pattern bayonet grip screw they want to sell to me? I just hate to give Sarco any more business. Thanks All, Doug
Nobody here has a loose screw? Doug
Try BDL. He has everything in his wonderful store - except leprosy!
On the subject of No.5 scabbards; I'm after a throat screw for one of these if someone has a spare or knows of a source?
Thanks,
Mark
It's a 6BA countersunk head. Should be readily available from any hardware or model shop
I made one some while back after finding the mouthpiece as a spare. Could do it again, I suppose.
The odds are that if the screw is missing, then the thread in the mouthpiece is stripped
The shortened No.1 scabbard bearhunter mentioned above is for the Australian Owen SMG bayonet. I've seen them on No.7Mk.1 bayonets a few times over the years too here in the USA. They fit well but are technically incorrect.
Nope. Brian Dick doesn't have them. DougQuote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
Got a No5 scabbard from Sarco. Painted flat black, came in a little bag with a "Made in India" sticker on it and a No5 bayonet didn't fit in it. This is the fix for them sending me the wrong item first. I guess I'll just have to go after it with a file to make it fit.
Still have been unable to find a screw and escushion, pair of grips with screws and escushion, and a scabbard for a Pattern 1907 bayonet with out going through the pain of Sarco. Doug
Sarco/Indian no5 scabbard doesn't have a spring at all. I give up. Doug
It does now......., I've just sent you one!
Just got it today. Very nicely done. The Indian one was brass and the blade just flopped around in there and could easily jump out right where you are about to land and perf a lung.
If you ever need any odd bits from here just let me know. thanks Doug
I don't think bayonets were issued with the scabbards unless you figure the QM issued one bayonet and one scabbard, they certainly were seperatly boxed. Keep in mind the same scabbards were issued with the ,No5, No6,, No8 and No9 as well as the L1A3
I got one without the mouthpiece many years ago, and I thought that I would never find it as a spare ... but I did a couple of years back, and a suitable screw was not hard to make.
Initial issued of bayonets were always made with scabbards.
You could always get the spare parts but as I remember now, you could never just get a bare scabbard, it always came as a scabbard assembly. The same as a bayonet. It always came from Ordnance as an assembly
Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, but a rummage through my British bayonet collection odds and ends reveals I am now in need of a 'SM 524 Spring, Mouthpiece' for the No.5 bayonet scabbard. (The bit that grips the blade inside the scabbard)
I don't suppose anyone would have a loose spare they could sell me?
Thanks,
Mark
Why didn't you ask when you were here? PM private address please
Would it be I was that organised. E.g. We initially arrived at the wrong entrance and the gate guard concerned gave us a very suspicious look when we announced we were 'there to see the weapons collection' - probably thought we were avid Andy McNab fans or something...:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
(It was the fault of the SatNav, honest)
I'll send you a PM.
Cheers,
Mark
Wow! Thanks. Anything you need from Seattle just let me know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
Now a friend of a friend has come up with a couple of hundred scabbards without the mouthpiece from Australia. I think he wants way to much for them. Maybe he will come to his senses in the fullness of time.
Now I have another one with the goofy red grips. "England" lightly branded into one. Otherwise excellent. Had to buy a cheap L1A1 bayonet to get the dumb scabbard. I couldn't believe it but I sold the bayonet for what I paid for the bayonet and scabbard all ready. From the looks of Ebay it seems that prices of these are down by half. Doug