Can someone tell me if Winchester #2404834 is listed? It also has SA-52 stamped behind the rear sight.
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Can someone tell me if Winchester #2404834 is listed? It also has SA-52 stamped behind the rear sight.
that's weird, but I just read (SA-52) marked behind sight was to indicate SA's rebuild in 1952. It showed a picture and everything. My wild guess is it was WWII rebuilt for use in that forgotten war that I try to thank those soldiers when ever I get the chance. hope this helped.
WRA 2322225 (oct 1943) WRA 2408884 (mar 1944) Your'si is some were in between my guess 1944 as it only @ 4000 from the 44 and almost 87000 from the 43. Does your M1 have a Sa barrel dated 50 or 51? though salvaged WWII barrels were used some. It would have been replaced if worn beyond army standards. Info and picture page 117 of Bruce Canfields Complete Guide to M1 Garand and the M1 Carbine.
Bob, I have the first two Volumes of Serial Numbers published in 1983 and 1986 by SRS. There is no listing for 2404834, but if there was, it most likely would be of a SA manufactured rifle. My books list about 30 rifles numbered from 2.31 through 2.63 which could be either SA or Winchester. As per Scott Duff, Winchesters assigned serial number block, 2305850 to 2655849, were grossly duplicated by Springfield Armory. Springfields serial numbers in this range began at apx. 2374xxx and continued throughout the balance of the range. The main sources of data for the rifles listed in the SRS books that I have, and most likey the other two, were the post WW2 records of Springfield Armory and the records of the DCM for NM rifles issued to clubs. Those rifles in the 2.31 through 2.63 range in the SRS books are SA production not Winchester.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob K
I'm ignorant, but the rifle says winchester on it but made or duplicated ser# by SA? I just thought it was a simple Question but am still taking my baby steps. sorry if I was misleading any one.
Dave, The rifle in question # 2404830 does have a Winchester produced receiver. What I am saying is that a SA manufactured rifle with the same serial number may also exsist. You have nothing to apoligize for, no mater how long some have been involved in the study of the U.S. Rifle Cal .30 M1, there is always something new we can all learn from each other. If that was not the case we would soon become bored.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveN
I recall "the only dumb ?'s are the ones not asked". What is a srs request? and was I understanding the SA-52 stamp on the heel of Bobs M1? I would think those with that stamp would be a little rare, are there many known out there? Thanx.
Dave, SRS stands for "Springfield Research Service". Back in about 1975 a man named Frank Mallory uncovered a large collection of serial number data on U.S. Military Arms and that was his start on a number of reference books he published. These books were not just on M1 Garnad serial numbers but also Krags, M 1903s, Colt SAA, Sharps and many others. If a listing of your weapon could be found Frank would send you an authenticating letter for $ 5.00. After the advent of computers and internet, SRS had a web page that you could look up serial numbers on and if you got a hit you could send for a letter of authenticaton. As I understand it, after Frank Mallory passed away the web site kind of went to pot.
As far as the SA-52 heal markings, that is just the Springfield Armory rebuild marking that was used only in 1952. As stated by Bruce N. Canfield, " The use of such markings applied to the receiver deviated from the normal procedure of stamping the stock to indicate that a rifle had been overhauled. After the 1952 period, rifles rebuilt at Springfield were generally stamped on the left side of the stock with a rebuild mark approximately midway between the pistol grip and the end of the butt. The most commonly seen markings of this type consist of "SA over a single letter" enclosed in either a three corner box or a square."
Also during this period some WW2 vintage M1C sniper rifles were altered to service rifle configuration. The 5 mounting holes in the receiver were plugged and the receivers assembled into service grade M1s. It is not uncommon today to encounter both standard M1 receivers and plugged M1C receivers with the "SA-52 markings." Of course Caldwell wrote this a number of years ago, before there were so many collectors of the M1 and M1 rifles from Gov't storage were still available. They are not as common today as they once were but they still are not considered "rare", by any means.
As an aside, Bruce N. Canfield is now working on a new book which, from what I hear, will be the most concise book on the M1 Garand ever published and is destined to become the new M1 Garand Bible. If you have a real interest in the M1 Garand it will be a must have.
joe it would make more sense to stamp the receiver than the stock as that would stay with the rifle as we know parts and stocks seem to get all mixed up. thanx again dave.
Springfield memos state about 100,000 to 125,000 rifles went through that rebuild program so they are not "rare" at all. I've collected about 800 serial numbers over the years while not specifically looking for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveN
Rebuild facilities did start marking the Facility code and date of overhaul, using electric pencil, on the receiver leg in the 1960s but, if you think about it, that marking means nothing after the rifle has left the rebuild facility. It may mean something to collectors, but to the solidier or marine that received the rifle, it ment absolutly zero. All they cared about was that the rifle functioned correctly, not who originally built it or who may have overhauled it. Also, just as parts got switched around on original rifles while they were in active service, parts also got switched around on the rebuilt/overhauled rifles. By now, it is quite possible that all that remains on a SA-52 marked rifle, from the time of the 1952 overhaul, is the receiver.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveN