Long Branch Markings

I have been trying to obtain a matching 1950 Long Branch. I have all of the other manufacturers represented in my collection (including a POF, which you don't see too often) and all match including bolt, mag and forend, and all with the appropriate markings specific to that manufacturer. All right, a little anal, but humour me. The reason I want a 1950 LB is because I was born in Canada in 1950. I am now a US citizen and apart from Canada have lived in England, Ireland and Saudi Arabia. The thing is that I have owned 2 and neither had the s/n on the mag or the forend. In fact, none of the 1950 LB's that I have seen either at gun shows or auction sites have the s/n on those parts. I am beginning to conclude that my northern cousins discontinued the practice sometime after the war. Any comments on this subject would be appreciated.

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Originally Posted by TerryChambers

The thing is that I have owned 2 and neither had the s/n on the mag or the forend. In fact, none of the 1950 LB's that I have seen either at gun shows or auction sites have the s/n on those parts. I am beginning to conclude that my northern cousins discontinued the practice sometime after the war. Any comments on this subject would be appreciated.

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Check the Canada Milsurp Knowledge Library for a detailed 94 pic photo montage of an all correct specimen belonging to my wife's collection.

1950 C No.4 Mk1* Long Branch Rifle
"All Matching Serial Numbers (unissued rifle)"

http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG(Click PIC to Enlarge)http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG

http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG(Click PIC to Enlarge)http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG

MKL Entry ....

1950 C No.4 Mk1* Long Branch Rifle (click here)

Note: There's NO serial number on underside of forestock, but should have "C" Broad Arrow Canadian Military Acceptance Mark. Serial number should be present on underside of magazine.

Regards,
Doug

The numbering of Long Branches...forends, butt, magazines...is strictly a unit thing....never done at factory. You will also see serial numbers stamped on DCRA or other LB forends....again....a method to quickly identify the rifle. Ron

RGG, where do you get the information that the forends were never marked at the factory? I'm not sure I'm buying this, for a number of different reasons, the first being pictures of racks of Long Branch rilfes in the factory, with the forends serialed! And, there are so many different LB rifles from N/Z, Greece, Britian, that have similar forend marking. Just wondering your source.
For the OP, keep your eyes peeled at gun shows and the auction sites. Nice LB's pop up fairly often. (too often...LOL)

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Originally Posted by rgg_7

The numbering of Long Branches...forends, butt, magazines...is strictly a unit thing....never done at factory. You will also see serial numbers stamped on DCRA or other LB forends....again....a method to quickly identify the rifle. Ron

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I'm in Canada, have examined countless numbers of Long Branches (1942 -1950) and own a few very good examples. These were never issued with a serial number stamped on the forend or magazine. I have however seen Long Branches that went into service or sold out of service to clubs that were serialized on these components for easy of identication or kept parts from being mixed. Long Branchs transferred to NZ are quite often serialized on the mag and sometime forend however it was done by the receiver not the source. This subject has been discuss a few times and I'm sure a few others will chim in. Ron

The practice of serialing forends stopped @early 1943 at LongBranch.

Never seen a magazine which appeared to be factory #'d.

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Originally Posted by rgg_7

The numbering of Long Branches...forends, butt, magazines...is strictly a unit thing....never done at factory.

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Originally Posted by Lee Enfield

Never seen a magazine which appeared to be factory #'d.

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Well, if that's correct, then I think that for whatever reason, this example shown in the MKL which the condition suggests was never issued to a unit, seems to be an anomaly. Note the serial number on Canadian Arsenals magazine the which if you look at up close, the "black" is inside the grooves of the lettering, suggesting it was stamped with the serial number before the black coating was applied, which could only have been done at the factory? :confused:

Examine the whole rifle in the 94 pic photo montage, then let me know what you guys think. ;)

http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG(Click PIC to Enlarge)http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG

http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG(Click PIC to Enlarge)http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG


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Regards,
Doug

To add to your comments, Doug, there are literally dozens if not hundreds of examples of the 92-95 series rifles that are the same as in your library. I need to find that picture of the rifles in the racks at Long Branch Arsenal-I have it saved somewhere.
As an aside, I have just acquired a 7/47 No. 5 Mk 1 that is 17 away from another I own. The latter is in unissued condition, the former in well used condition. The latter does not have forearm serialed, where as the former (used one) does. More fuel for the fire!

I found the picture I was talking about. It is one of twenty or so of a photo montage of the Long Branch Arsenal in the early days. I've included a number of them for interest and veracity.

Interesting ... thanks limpetmine ... :cheers:

Definitely early days (pre 1943?) ... :)

Look at the serial numbers on the undersides of the LB's lined up in this pic .... :thup:

Attachment 16980
(Click PIC to Enlarge)

Move mouse off pic to see bottom area of photo.

Regards,
Doug

Different criteria was applied by different factories / countries / at different times. Anyone with copies of R.A.E.M.E. or A.E.M.E. issues in the applicable countries can provide a background; this of course applied to ordnance depots and unit armourers rather than the factories. Perhape Peter Laidler can weigh into this one too, from his practical experience.

One should not generalise on whether magazines or fore-ends were serial numbered at the factories. I have seen numbers electro-engraved on the bottoms of magazines that look like it was done at the factory. But in most cases they were stamped with individual stamps as a local armourer or workshop would do. Of course this does not usually transcribe to the No.1 rifle but can be found to flow through to the Nos. 5, 7 8 and 9 models as well. Again, the factory where rifles were originally produced comes into the equation along with the era.

Regarding serial numbers being stamped on the bottom of fore-woods, near the muzzle, it can work both ways, depending upon the period of time. This was done as bedding of the fore-end affected the rifle's shooting, so it was necessary to mate them up again after it was removed in the course of repair, refit or fine-tuning. The same applies to the No.1 (SMLE) rifle of course.

Enjoy your Enfields,
Ian

Thank you all for the interesting comments and especially to limpetmine for the fascinating photos of the Long Branch works.