Long Branch Mk.1 cocking pieces - hens teeth?

I've posted on other forums regarding the rarity of Mk.1 Long Branch cocking pieces (you know, the round button-type). I've had comments from Canadian friends stating that the cocking pieces are in the realm of golden rocking horse poo (1 level rarer than rocking horse poo, apparently) in Canada, but what about in the US or UK? How often do these blighters turn up not attached to a rifle? I have an option to buy a much later Long Branch that, for some strange reason, has an early LB cocking piece on it, swapping out the cocking pieces (I have an LB Mk.2 to hand - you never know when you will need one), then selling the rifle - it's a lot of messing around and will be expensive, but if that is my only option...

The way things are going on ebay for LB parts (an LB Mk.1 rear sight went for about $250 a few days ago), I think my options are a tad limited lol.

I think they are probably very challenging to find nowadays. ;)

Lance tells me I need an Enfield marked one for a 1931 Trials Sniper Rifle in my wife's collection that he checked out when he vistied, so I've been looking as well .... :lol:

For other members who may want to see one for comparison and with thanks to Advisory Panel member Lance, you could check the Canada - Milsurp Knowledge Library (click here)

A rare 1941 No.4 Mk1 Long Branch Rifle (click here) .....

Complete with a 150 picture photo montage, this is a fascinating rifle to study its markings and components in detail, with some interesting oddities and variations from the standard No.4 Mk1* noted in the "Collector's Feedback and Comments" section of the main Knowledge Library entry. There's also information with pictured examples of how to check for a correct front waisted sight protector, versus a home made, or possible fake.

http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG(Click PIC to Enlarge)http://photos.imageevent.com/badgerd...20_Medium_.JPG

Regards,
Badger

I don't think they're that uncommon: I've had at least three LBs with the button cocking piece - one Mk1 and the rest Mk1*. The only one I have left is a nice original 1942 "5L" series with a 2-groove barrel, early-type forend with cut-off slot and a MkIII rearsight.

I've seen them about. Even have at at least one, currently, but it's on the 3L (it came w/ it). Don't forget to check Savage rifles if you are somewhere like a show. They DO end up w/ a fair number of mismatched bolts and bits these days, so what you think is a garden variety Savage cocking piece may very well be of other origins! Just be prepared to buy the rifle to get the part...(Reminds me of M1 Garand parts collecting!)

Besides Savage, Long Branch, and Enfield, Singer mfg. made this cocking piece variation. If you DO find an Enfield one by accident, buy it and I reckon Badger will make you happy that you did.:D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jmoore

If you DO find an Enfield one by accident, buy it and I reckon Badger will make you happy that you did.

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Yes.... :dancingbanana:

Regards,
Doug

Badger, I will be keeping my eyes peeled for you lol. I will be visiting a local gunsmith tomorrow who, for some reason, has bins full of Lee-Enfield parts (of course the bins could be tiny, and he might have been showing off), so I will be having a good rummage.

The knowledge library article Badger pointed out above is what got me interested in 1941 Long Branches in the first place, and I am using it as a guide in my restoration.

This topic gave me a good reason to spend a little time in the gunroom tonight. I only have three MkI cocking pieces (LB, S, and SM, but no Enfield).

I will keep my eyes open for an LB and Enfield at some upcoming shows I will be attending.

The business of "appropriate" parts is a vexed one.

Which is more "authentic": a rifle exactly as it was when it left the services, or one that has been "restored" to the way it MAY HAVE left the factory?

With both Lee Enfields and Garands there were multiple main manufacturers and many sub-contractors, and on top of that there were wartime exigencies and the usual production "stuff-ups".

Parts would have been sent where required to meet deadlines. If a part was to the current specification, it was CORRECT for the parent equipment, generally regardless of receiver markings. Yes, your trusty No4 Mk1 MAY have left the factory sporting one of those nasty Mk2 locking bolts and an "emergency' Mk2 cocking piece. At the earliest opportunity, as per instructions, either unit level or at the first FTR, those bits would have been rapidly removed and replaced with the more functional variants. After tis work, the rifle is STILL an authentic service rifle.

Mr. Laidler will also tell you that there are regular instructions issued to perform modifications and upgrades. And as for a situation like an FTR programme, all bets are off. When a rifle comes out the other end of FTR it is absolutely "authentic" as per the specifications of the time. If new critical components are numbered to the receiver, that's as kosher as it can get.

In Badger's case he won't be fooling anyone for a long time as his rifle is quite extensively photo-documented.

However, I don't think I would actually change out the parts, as I think it was likely done in service. Possibly when it was fitted w/ the scope? The time frame would be about perfect! It's nice to have an "appropriate" part on hand, as well, at least for reference purposes!

Gratuitous photos:

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC01376-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC01377-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...C0136711-1.jpg
:D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by spinecracker

The way things are going on ebay for LB parts (an LB Mk.1 rear sight went for about $250 a few days ago), I think my options are a tad limited lol.

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The one you mentioned sold 4 days ago and had 16 bids. Another one ended tonight with only one bid for $125.:confused:

That's ebay for you. I know the person who had the LB rear sight that went for $125 - I had my fingers crossed for him, but I also get worried when the parts start going out of my price range (which is not high). I'm glad that I picked mine up for $75! I may have also located an LB Mk.1 cocking piece that I can afford - the joys of the internet lol.

My visit to the gunsmith turned out profitably - picked up an unserialed LB magazine with the solid underside and a nice plum tint to the bluing - for $30. He also had a selection of bands and some other magazines (mostly Indian service with several serial numbers stamped on them, but he was going to be selling them for $15 each - not bad for my neck of the woods lol).

I have a late 1939 British military issue BSA SMLE MkIII with a standard No4 cocking piece . Would that have been original ?

Update - a whole bunch of metal parts turned up for me yesterday. All I have to do now is find the right rear hand guard and buttstock, and change over the cocking pieces, and then I will be ready for photos. By some miracle, I ended up with a spare LB hinged upper band in very good condition. Any idea of how much these sell for in Canada/US? I know that they are for sale at Springfield Sporters for $350 (yikes!), but I wanted to know what a sane price may be.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1064-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1063-1.jpg

Spincracker what does the upper handguard look like the fits this hinged upper band:dunno:

Paul, the upper hand guard has a recess in the wood to allow the hinge to fit properly. It is where the oblong hole is in the metal cap.

PS. Thanks, Badger for sorting out the photos - I am too computer-illiterate to work it out lol.