New No5 with condition issue

Howdy all, I just acquired this little number. I was aware that something was weird about the forend tip but the rest looked a million bucks so I got it anyway.
There is no wear visible anywhere on the rifle, wood or metal.
I was told the bore was mint, but it's not, it's good, but dark in the grooves.
I was also told the forend tip was a factory job, but I think it's the original metal cap, cut off, and glued to the cut off forend just forward of the band, WHY?!?!?!?
There has been an attempt to affect upward pressure from the forend at the band, to the extent that it presses on the top wood. The pressure marks on the wood indicate good symmetry in the setup, so I'll see how it shoots, it might be good...
This is the best metal finish I've seen on a No5, it's like new, as it the wood, it's such a pitty about the vandalism. The search for a perfect one will continue.
Still I may get a mint, beech No5 forend along the line, live in hope...

Just a thought, but anyone think a spliced repair might be an improvement?

Tom interesting woodwork, beats me why someone would do it. Do you know any of it's history.

Myles

P.S the letter worked thanks mate.

Was it maybe to put up pressure on the barrel? I it's the wrong way to do it but ......


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If it's been cut off just ahead of the front band I see no reason you could not cut it further back to the CENTER of the band groove and attach a new forend piece shaped like the original. You would neet to find a suitable chunk of wood for appearance's sake. Your joint would be hidden by the front band.

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Originally Posted by me2

If it's been cut off just ahead of the front band I see no reason you could not cut it further back to the CENTER of the band groove and attach a new forend piece shaped like the original. You would neet to find a suitable chunk of wood for appearance's sake. Your joint would be hidden by the front band.

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It's my next best option to getting a new forend, but the job would have to be something really special, to not be apparent upon close inspection. I hope to not need to go down this path.

It is a very nice No 5 and it is a shame about the forend. I may know someone who could help out - email me if needed.

Cheers,
Troy

Mk1 1 No4 fore-ends are simplicity itself to convert to No5 spec. We had many hundreds of ex No4 fore-ends (and butts incidentally.....) supplied by the gun trade to UK Military Ordnance. The only difference that I could see was where a piece of wood had been inserted and glued into the now open lightening recess of the shortened fore-end.

The wood match and fit of the small patch (I seem to recall that the patch was only an inch or so long) was very good and was almost unnoticeable. They were supplied by Westley Richards to UK MoD contract. That was good woodwork, unlike the L42 fore-end and handguard butchery. But that's another story.........

To be honest, looking at TBones fore-end, I doubt that splicing it will save it unless the new fore-part is dovetailed in. A butt joint under the band won't fix this fore-end for more than 20 minutes in my opinion.

I would mortice the repair into the forend, with the external faces abutting under the band. I can see this being strong enough. The tennon on the front piece would be concealed withing the rear section(in the mortice). I said "splice", but this was not really the correct term. I would imaging that I'd run the tennon in about 50mm, and then glue and peg it from inside, without allowing the pegs to exit the underside of the forend.
My hesitation in this, is, can this be done so as to truly repair the forend? or would the colour be a giveaway, or the lack of chatter marks on the top of the exposed tip, etc
I have some beech scraps from unservicable No4 wood sets. Maybe this is viable....[COLOR="Silver"]

Tom,

Pm sent.

I can see that way working for you TBone as an example of your undoubted cabinet making skills - of which we're all jealous! It'd last forever on the rifle range as the fore-end is free of any influence and vibration of the barrel. BUT........ I doubt if it'd stand the stresses and strains of a long stalk/patrol in the jungle where it'd be constantly drenched!

If it was a normal shooter/collector (or one of ours at work for example) I'd just get a replacement fore-end or retro modify a No4 Mk1 type

Good project. Can we see the photographic results if you repair it Tom?

I don't know how you find time for work with all these projects..................

As Peter has often pointed out, the wood under the forend cap tended to rot under jungle conditions and this might have been the reason for shortening. Making up a new No. 5 forend out of No. 4 Mk 1 wood, would seem to me to be a far easier job than splicing a bit on. And the plug for the internal lightening groove would be hidden by the forend cap anyway.

I had a dig through my scraps/spares and found a viable proposition for the forends replacement, it's off a 1941 Maltby, but it's warped. Luckily this is towards the front, so I think I can get a viable No5 forend out of it. The low cut mag cutoff area will have to be patched, but this will allow me to hide the cut off lug recess too. As I'll be chopping it up, there will be plenty of the wood available for these patches.
Also the species and colour is correct.
The whole forend will be reduced a little at least, so the varnish will all be gone, and by the look of it, it's not too oily. This could be a fairly perfect solution, as the forend is useless as a long one, and fine where I need it!
Also it hasn't been heavily sanded or shaped close to the wrist so it won't be undersized.

There is aNo5 forend on evil bay but it appears to have been repaired in the past so might not be suitable for such a lovely little carbine...

Tom,
I would take the safety lever of the old girl as it has been modified to pass the import customs saftey checks. Cost me over $200 to have mine modified, so you have one to send overseas if you intend bringing in another No4. As you can't do the work yourself for something so simple as undoing a screw
you have to use their gunsmiths.
Myles

I'm probably mistaken, but the forestock looks like a No.4 cutdown. Just a note about the date as well....10/47. I thought July of '47 (7/47) was the last batch for No.5's ?

While we're on the topic of No.5's, I'm wondering how often you chaps come across them either in a private sale, gunshop or gunshows ? The last 3 gunshows I've been at this year averaged at least 6 at each show.

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Originally Posted by Bearclaw

Tom,
I would take the safety lever of the old girl as it has been modified to pass the import customs saftey checks. Cost me over $200 to have mine modified, so you have one to send overseas if you intend bringing in another No4. As you can't do the work yourself for something so simple as undoing a screw
you have to use their gunsmiths.
Myles

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You've lost me, what do you mean remove the safety lever? The safety is standard on these like a No4, it just doesn't pass import requirements because it isn't red in the fire position. So they csk a little dip and put red paint in it. The No4 wood I'm going to cut down is on a No4 for illustration, the No5 safety isn't marked at all, as it came in decades ago.

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Originally Posted by dieppe42

I'm probably mistaken, but the forestock looks like a No.4 cutdown. Just a note about the date as well....10/47. I thought July of '47 (7/47) was the last batch for No.5's ?

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The forend is a cut down No5 forend, done for reasons I cant see for the life of me. I hear there are production dates up to 12/47, so 10/47 is pretty late.