Dose anyone have a scanned copy of the Aussie L4A4 Parts List?
In particular the accessories pages. I'm looking for the AUSTRALIAN L4A1 magazine NSN numbers and designations for the following parts :-
Case
Platform
Spring
Retainer
Bottom Plate
Printable View
Dose anyone have a scanned copy of the Aussie L4A4 Parts List?
In particular the accessories pages. I'm looking for the AUSTRALIAN L4A1 magazine NSN numbers and designations for the following parts :-
Case
Platform
Spring
Retainer
Bottom Plate
We had L4A4's in Australia and Malaya and I seem to remember that Australia only purchased the MINIMUM quantity of magazines that came with the CES of the gun - a box of 12. She didn't make any more due to patent/property rights and thereafter used the interchangeable L2 rifle 30 round magazines that worked just as well, were locally made, didn't infringe anyones property rights and were readily available within the B2(?) VAOS Ordnance system. We also made our own barrels too because Enfield couldn't/didn't have the IPR rights to those either.
There was a lot more to this Bren/L4 saga..........
Hope this helps KtK
PtP, I'm trying to work out if Australia had its own 1005-66- coded parts for the L4A1 magazines components LITHGOW made in 1973 and 1974
Even the Bottom Plates are different to the ones used on the L2A1 20 Round magazines and the 30 Round magazines for the L2A1 Rifle. They are marked MA73 MG 5675 and MA74 MG 5675 on the inside.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ght_side-1.jpg https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...Markings-1.jpg
That's interesting....... in a nerdish sort of way KtK as I only remember having the Australian 30 round straight rifle magazines for our L4 guns and only rarely - if ever - saw any original pommy curved magazines as shown. This seems to be confirmed by the fact that those curved Australian magazines are all 1973/74, manufactured after I'd left.
It would seem strange that the pommy floor plates etc etc aren't interchangeable with the Australian ones. Have you tried Australian parts on a pom mahagine to see whether they interchange the other way? Maybe they don't interchange with good reason. Being that Australia changed the spec sufficiently for them to look alike but JUST different enough to escape the IP rights issue.
Canny lads at Lithgow.
There was a bit of ill feeling between Lithgow and Enfield (at management/government level I assume) over Commonwealth sales of the L1A1 rifles. Those from Lithgow were much cheaper than Enfield so the Commonwealth nations bought them from Lithgow.................. using money gifted by guess where.............? Yep, got it in one.........., Britain
Peter, the Bottom Plates for these unique Lithgow L4A1 magazines are physically the same as those used on L2A1/L4A1 magazines. What's strange first off is there are markings on it. Typically Australian magazines have no markings on them anywhere. Secondly the markings on the inside of the Bottom Plate are not what you would expect.
The plate used on the L2A1/L4A1 magazines has a NSN of 1005-99-960-2044 and on British magazines the part number 9602044 is marked on them along with the maker and date of production.
In that case this Australian magazine should be marked MA 73 960-2044. But it doesn't, its marked MA73 MG 5675, this makes the Bottom Plate unique and different from a normal Bottom Plate.
I need to get a life. :madsmile::sos:
I'm totally lost now...............
Hopefully this will clarify things.
TOP: Standard British and Australian L2A1 & L4A1 magazine Bottom Plate (this one made by Rolls Razor in 1959, part number 9602044)
BOTTOM: Australian L4A1 magazine Bottom Plate (note the use of a drawing number reference MG 5675)
I've just measured the Bottom Plates. The Australian L4A1 Bottom plate is shorter then a normal British/Australian Bottom Plate by 1.29 mm. This plate is unique to the Australian L4A1 magazine..... "believe it or not" :runaway:
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...omPlates-1.jpg
I may be wrong here but I dont think Australia would use the 66 Nato country code on Lithgow Bren parts as they were British in Origin. All the Bren chests that came from Aus appear to carry -99- designations, even the Lithgow and Inglis produced guns.
Kev,hope I can put across some info that may be relevant,but I have no access to L2A1 IPL's.
The TOP bottom plate (960-2044) is 'period'correct for 1959 for the L4A1 Bren mag 960-0089 according to the 1959 IPL for the L4A2 LMG.
Fast forward to the 1978 IPL for the L4A4 LMG and the magazine retains the same part number (960-0089) but the bottom plate has been replaced with bottom plate 961-7944 which has the drawing number MG5675 (same as stamped on the MA73 Aussie bottom plate)
The later bottom plates are the same for UK and MA.
Hope this helps ?
I Will try and narrow down the date when the bottom plate was superceded.
ATB Kevin
The 1963 L4A4 LMG IPL lists the bottom plate part number only as C1/MG 5675.
This may also be relevent -
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...BTMPLATE-1.jpg
ATB Kevin
Kev, that answers my question and also confirms the length difference between the two plates. I guess the new plates never got given a NSN number.
Are there any other changes in NSN numbers between the early and later L4A1 magazines?
For both early and latter magazines they have the following NSN numbers:-
Early L4A1 Magazines
Case: 1005-99-960-2492
Platform: 1005-99-960-2794
Spring: 1005-99-960-0090
Retainer: 1005-99-960-3000
Bottom Plate: 1005-99-960-2044
Later L4A1 Magazines
Case: 1005-99-960-2492
Platform: 1005-99-960-2794
Spring: 1005-99-960-0090
Retainer: 1005-99-960-3000
Bottom Plate: 1005-99-961-7944
No other changes I can see.
The new/later bottom plates to drawing MG5675 are NSN 961-7944
If you ever come across an Aussie L4 IPL give can you give me a shout :thup:
ATB Kevin
Typically your correct, generally any part that is common between Australia and Britain will have the same country code even though its made in two different countries.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brit plumber
But there are some parts that are 'Australian' so have the 66 code. Classic example:
7.62mm L1A1 Rifle (Australian) 1005-66-100-2001
7.62mm L1A1 Rifle (British) 1005-99-960-0001
or
Slide, Cocking Handle (Australian) 1005-66-010-2099
Slide, Cocking Handle (British) 1005-99-960-2302
In New Zealand the majority of parts for the L2A2 SUIT Sight have 98 (New Zealand) designation as country... this is because they are sourced through a New Zealand company. NSN coding can be confused and complicated sometimes.