Turkish - looks like it...
... but not the '38, which was a short rifle (OAL 44") AND had a butt slot for the sling.
The stock length of 45" means that it can only be for a full-length rifle. Looking through Ball for G98-types with pistol grip, bolt take-down hole, and nosecap spring below (not on the right side), I can only see the following candidate:
Turkish 1903
of which Ball provides a good color photo.
Patrick
:wave:
Who says no Turkish 1903?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
m4a3sherman
As I understand it, there is no such thing as a Turkish 1903 or M38 or any of that
Please inform Robert W.D. Ball, author of the standard work "Mauser Military Rifles of the World" that he is in error. And please cite your authority for that statement. If you cannot quote an accepted source, and the statement was based on hearsay, I respectfully suggest we all go along with Mr. Ball's nomenclature. The rifle described as a Turkish Model 1903 is described on Page 337 of the 3rd Edition, which also includes a good photo in the color section. And please take a look at P.205, which presents a list of Mauser production data for export contracts from 1887-1914. This specifically lists a 1903 contract model for Turkey. A contract for 200,000 rifles is not a "rag-bag of hand-me downs", although they may certainly look like that now!.
There is also a picture and a description of a Turkish Model 1903 on P.138 of "Mauser Bolt Rifles" by Ludwig Olson (also 3rd Edition), although this looks a bit different (no take-down ring, nosecap spring at side) So that makes two internationally recognised experts who are wrong, according to your unnamed source who claims there was no such thing as a Turkish 1903.
BTW, one of my pet hates is the kind of person who says they know better than what is in the book. If you then ask them if they have actually taken the trouble to pass on the information to the author, the response is likely to be silence. The appropriate English expression for this situation is "put up or shut up". Please note, this remark is not directed at you, but at whoever fed you this opinion.
Patrick
:wave:
A rose, by any other name...
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jmoore
I've learned that even our published authors who frequent this site have had to make changes to their work just because they published- making them easy targets for those with contrary or additional facts.
That supports my point - if someone has better, verified information with checkable sources then they should pass it on the the author, so that the next edition may be improved. But that which one can only describe as hearsay should be left in the bar where one heard it.
Let us agree that the expression "Model 1903" is a handy tag for "The 200,000 or so rifles made by Mauser in fulfilment of the 1903 contract made with the Turkish Government, in caliber 7,65mm, later altered to 7,92mm (you know, that caliber which is always referrred to as 8mm, although it's not really) based on the Gewehr 98 but with a few detail alterations made to the specification, so Mauser may well have called it the 1903 Turkish Contract Rifle etc etc blah blah blah ..."
So how many of those who have one shoot a "U.S. Rifle Model of 1917"**, like it says on the receiver***. Nobody. We all shoot P17s over here - not even M1917s.:madsmile:
I worry about how the things shoot, not the label. The label is identification, not holy writ.
So m4a3sherman, whatever the Turks called it, you made a great find:thup:. Better get back to those sales and see if you can find the rest;)
Patrick
:wave:
** Actually, of course, it says U.S. RIFLE MODEL OF 1917 - all capitalized
*** No it doesn't. It's U.S. MODEL OF 1917 - see how one can get very basic facts wrong if you don't check! :o Especially when writing after midnight!
