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A friend has approached me with a Mauser 71/84 that he wants to sell me. I have only seen one photo of it, seems a bit rough. Haven't got a price yet. I have never owned one of these, always been interested in them. Anything I should look for as far as red flags? Hopefully I will get to see it in person this week. Thanks!
snap some photographs of it when you get it and post it on here before you buy- then we can tell you a good bit about the particular one you are being offered. If you don't mind disclosing, around how much is your friend asking for this rifle? If it is cheap enough, it would almost be worth it no matter the condition(well, within reason anyway).
Haven't heard a price yet. He's been kinda slow in getting back to me on specifics. Will get some pics up when I see the rifle.
A pile of 71/84's came in from Spain 1961/62. Many were mint and many were beat. If you are looking at a beat gun it is a wall hanger. Not sue if anyone is making the ammo and it is a little tricky handloading. I have a nice one upstairs and have never fired it. Oh, well.
Purchased a Spandau made M71 cavalry carbine over the weekend. The 71 was the first mass produced military rifle using metal cartridges. Cases and bullets are still available here. the 71/84 was apparently the same r1fle with a magazine. The questions to ask are: is it fully numbered and how good are the stamps and cartouches? Has it been messed around with or is it still in original condition? And (most important) has it been proofed? Some have been used with Nitro powder and are considered unsafe. Most of these are damaged and the barrels are unsafe. `Tis best to have it re-proofed if shooting is intended.
Well, it may all be moot, as the seller has seemed to have been abducted by aliens or something. Won't get back to me on it. Some folks, huh?
Well ya never know, do ya? Going to see it Friday, will stay posted.............
Very good sir. You know there are a few things I always look for when I inspect a possible addition and one of them is bore condition- so obviously bring a bore light or something. Also making sure there are no extra holes in the receiver from bubba; no-brainers. However, as I have handled very few 71/84' I think it's worth asking about more specific things to be on the look out for. What are some of the things Anzac15 should check specifically for a 71/84. ( and pardon me while I take notes here as well. )
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anzac15
Yes. Apart from the checks you should make on any rifle that old - Check that all the bits are there! This is not a joke, and not so easy to tell if you have never dismantled one.
Bits that are frequently missing include:
1. The magazine-tube spring.
2. The boss on the breech end of the spring. This is shaped with a step, so that when the last round has been fired, it prevents
3. The loading interlock fork* from moving in from the left, which in its turn prevents the carrier from descending to pick up a non-existent round. In this state, the rifle can only be used as a single-shot rifle.
The parts are dimensioned so that when the last round has been fired, the interlock fork will come up against the step on the boss, thus preventing the boss from being pushed right back onto the carrier tray (causing a snarl-up). If the boss on the end of the spring is missing, the end of the spring will EITHER become tangled up with the interlock fork OR work through until it is tangled with the carrier. Do NOT try to force the action open, unless you are keen on making a new spring. If you have this particular snarl-up, you will have to dismantle the action quite carefully to get it all untangled again. (A collector friend had this problem, and was completely baffled. I am, as in most cases, speaking from experience!)
*I am not sure what the correct term for this item is, but it is to be found on the left side of the mechanism.
If a round is still left in the magazine, the spring pushes it back so far that the front end of the fork can slip behind the rim of the base of the cartridge. The fork is pivoted, and so the back end of the fork moves away from the carrier, permitting the carrier to move down and pick up a round.
If this is all a bit tricky to understand, you have my sympathy. I did not get it at all until I actually had a 71/84 in my hands to play with. Failing that, if you can get a look at an 1886 Kropatschek, which is a rifle with basically the same mechanism, adapted for an 8mm bullet, you will be better able to understand what I am endeavoring to describe.
In short, the spring could be replaced, and the boss could be turned up if you have an original to copy. Don't bother looking for dimensioned drawings - I doubt there are any to be found - you must have an original to copy.
The interlock fork is quite impossible to duplicate unless you have an original. Like the extractor fork on a Martini, the chances of getting it right by cut-and try methods are approximately 5/8 of FA (for UK readers) or zilch (for the rest). For the normal user I would recommend - if the interlock fork is missing, look for a different rifle.
Lack of any of the 3 components described above will prevent the rifle functioning as a repeater. And you have got to have the rifle in your hands to tell! Buying online is a definite no-no in this case, unless the seller warrants that all parts are present and functioning.
Patrick
:wave:
---------- Post added at 10:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:10 PM ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by Calif-Steve
Not so. Lee makes economical dies. Cases are available. You just need 0.446 lead bullets in the range 320-500 gn and with Brinell hardness around 10-12. No harder than 15. And load with Swiss No. 4 or 3 (FFg or FFFg). Or send a lot of money to Buffalo Arms - they have ready-loaded ammo, at a price.*
Dear Steve, in the nicest possible way, and with no derogatory intent ... chicken!:D
Go on, have a go!:thup:
Patrick
:wave:
*Why not buy a 20-pack to try the rifle out, and then reload, using neck sizing only - you may get the taste for BPCRs?
Guys, thanks a lot. This is precisely why I think this is the best darned forum concerning collectible military arms on the net. The info will be seriously pertained to whilst looking at the rifle. I have owned a lot of Mausers, this will be my first 71/84 if the deal goes through. I have always had a fascination with these. Fingers crossed, and hopefully will have some pics to share soon!
This is an interesting photo guide to the `71:-
Disassembling the 71-84 Mauser
There was a bunch of us that got together on Sunday afternoons to shoot. This was during the time that some of the 71/84 rifles were brought in in the late 1950's, by Hy Hunter I believe. The standard rifles were something like $9.95 and for a few dollars more you could get a "hand select" rifle. One of the guys ordered a dozen of the rifles with one being the hand select. The standard rifles showed use, but the bore was perfect on all of them. The hand select rifle was just brand new. The original ammunition dating from the 1880's was $10 per hundred. It was original paper patch bullet blackpowder loads, and was very accurate. We were never able to duplicate the accuracy with a handload.
Well, if you take a look at the link posted by the other Patrick, you will understand why I wrote that if any of those vital bits are missing, you need an original to copy! And the link, as good as it is and as far as it goes, does not show those bits I referred to. But you can see that if you dismantle one of these ingenious mechanismsy you really, really need a clear workbench, a compartmented tray for the bits, and a clean floor so that you can find the bits you dropped!
Patrick
:wave:
OK.....went to look at the Mauser. It was filthy, it was Bubba'd, and it was $40. It was also an Amberg Arsenal, King Ludwig of Bavaria version. All matching of course, bore is good. But, and this is a big but, I think it's a carbine that has only had the wood cut down. As soon as I find my frickin' camera, I'll get some photos on here. (oh, yeah, I bought it by the way. Couldn't help it)