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I was wondering what produces the best results for cleaning the stocks on my rifles. I am not going to refinish anything and only want to clean grease, oil and other light grime. I like the used look that they all have, they are afterall old, but I would like to have something a little cleaner to hold when I shoot without removing any finish or added paint like rack numbers that each of its owners added to it.
Clean with Krud Kutter household cleaner in a sink. Wash stock with water. Let dry and reapply linseed oil or other desired finish. You cannot clean or degrease and then not reapply an oil or finish of some type.
For oil finished stocks, I've found that just rubbing them down with a cloth soaked in linseed oil cut with turpentine will lift out the crap while keeping the stock in original condition.
I've seen gunsmithing videos on enfields and the guy says that "simple green" works for stocks and metal to clean them. Anyone else use this stuff?
Here's a simple formula for cleaning oil finished surfaces. Some of the detergents mentioned might be better for the stocks that are heavily soiled.
Cleaning Oil Finish Wood Furniture
Regards,
Jim
I use Concentrated Simple Green, undiluted, and 000 steel wool to remove grime. It's non-caustic and works quickly. It should not remove paint as it is water based. Just go over one small area at a time, work quickly and then wipe off the residue with a damp towel. Then let the stock dry.
I am always scared to use harsh chemicals like turpentine, especially on old guns, but it does come from a reputable university. I'm thinking of trying simple green, but even that scares me. You can probably tell that I don't clean stocks very often. :)
So what's harsh about turpentine? Nothing at all - it's a natural wood product. Natural turpentine, of course! Not the petrochemical product that is sold as turpentine substitute!
A piece of old linen or cotton sheet dampened with natural turpentine can be used to wipe down grubby areas of woodwork, and it really fires up the grain, so that you can see how good the wood would look if it was polished. Linen is a little harder and rubs/polishes more than cotton. When surface dirt has been removed, take another clean piece of cotton/ linen, dampen it with natural turpentine, pour a couple of drops of linseed oil onto the rag, and polish it into the wood. The turpentine acts as a carrier to get the linseed oil into the pores of the wood, so do not be surprised that you do not get an instant shine. Repeat after a couple of days, again and again. Slowly the turpentine will feed the oil into the wood and the wood will develop a fine surface. Do not be tempted to make a quick job by sloshing on the linseed oil, as this will result in a sticky surface that takes an eternity to dry out. But if you do overdo the oil, simply go over the wood with the turpentine-moistened rag again.
You can experiment with the natural turpentine/linseed oil mix until you are satisfied with the results, without any damage to the stock. But get the natural materials from a professssional paint supplier, not chemical imitations from a D-I-Y bodgers store!
And wood that is supposed to keep a stable form - like a gunstock - should NEVER be soaked through with water!
:wave:
Patrick
absolutely right Patrick. I wasn't clear on which turp you were referring to. I'm a painter and that stuff is pretty potent so I tend to shy away from it a little. I know that I have switched from turp to OMS (odourless mineral spirits) for my paintings as it is safer to be around. Has anyone used OMS and linseed together? It's kind of interesting that the same ingredients are used for two of my favourite things, guns and art.
I usually cut my linseed oil with OMS as per directions on the can. It helps cut dry time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazysod
mdrim13
I have used the Turpentine/Boiled Linseed Oil mixed 50/50 for years and it works great. Give the stock a heavy coat and let it set about 30 minutes. Then wipe it down good with toweling. If the first attempt didn't remove all the crud, do it again. If you have heavy deposits of crud you may have rub these areas lightly with 4/0 steel wool after coating the stock with the 50/50. After the stock is cleaned, the 50/50 makes a good finish when applied in very light coats. Put a dab on an area and smooth it out until it will spread no farther, then move over and apply another dab.
Believe it or not, for gentle cleaning, coating the stock in gasoline and letting it stand for a day or two, then buffing off will remove a LOT of crud without any impact to the original finish of the stock.
There is a product in Canada available at Loblaws Superstore and it is their house brand heavy duty liquid cleaner at $6.99 for a US gallon. This stuff works slicker than snot on a stick to remove: grease, oil, crud and anything else on the stock. I can take a beater, fireplace ready POS and it looks almost new after a good hot water bath and a couple of sprayings of the cleaner and some steaming to remove any dents. Missing wood you cannot create, but you can sure raise a dent. A coat of cabinet makers alcohol stain in a blended colour along with an hour or two of boning the stock and NO steel wool or sandpaper to be used, you will have a stock that almost looks like the day it was made.
Very fine steel/brass wool can be a great cleaner when used with linseed oil. It works well to clean off grit and grime. The steel/brass wool need to be very fine though, like 0000. Just my opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
mdrim13
Is denatured alcohol suitable for old dirty stocks or is turpentine better ?
I have had good success with Murphy's oil soap and warm water. The BLO/Turpentine works quite well also. Patience and perceverance seem to be the key. I lack the former loads of the latter.
The idea that linseed oil does any good in the preservation or restoration of any wood finish is a total fallacy.
If a piece of wood has an obvious finish on it you should first identify what that finish is before doing any “cleaning”. Shellac, regardless of its’ age, is soluble in alcohol or ammonia. To test the surface locate a less obvious location and lightly wet your finger tip with some alcohol and tap with your finger on that location repeatedly while blowing on your finger. As the alcohol evaporates the surface will start to get sticky. If this happens then you know that it is shellac and go no further. If it is shellac do not use any potion, concoction, or the like that has either alcohol or ammonia in it. If the surface of the stock has grease, oil, or wax that you are trying to remove dampen, not soak, a soft cloth with mineral spirits and whip the surface until clean. Immediately after this cleaning, us a solution of water and a pure detergent (Orvus) at room temperature. Use very little of the Orvus as it is a concentrate. With another soft absorbent cloth wet the cloth with this solution and wring it out tight. Wipe the surface down with this cloth and dry with another soft cloth. When dry apply a good paste wax and buff.
This below information was found on the Web site of the American Institute for Conservation (AIC) AIC - The American Institute for Conservation “The American Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works (AIC) is the national membership organization of conservation professionals. Its members include conservators, educators, scientists, students, archivists, art historians, and other conservation enthusiasts in over twenty countries around the world.”
“It was once thought that furniture needed to be “fed” with various mixtures of oils and other materials to keep it from drying out. However, a better approach would be to keep furniture in a stable environment. Furniture oils are not recommended for maintenance as many of them contain linseed oil or other drying oils, and when used repeatedly will create a gummy, insoluble surface coating that darkens and obscures the grain of the wood. Other furniture polishes contain non-drying oils such as lemon oil, but attract and entrap dirt and grime. Silicone polishes are also not recommended as they leave a film that is difficult to remove and can interfere with future finish treatments.”
“The best maintenance for clear-varnished furniture is a coating of good paste wax. Wax is a very stable material that does not change chemically over time and provides protection from moisture and airborne pollutants. Good quality paste wax is available in most hardware stores. A thin coat applied following the directions on the can is all that is needed, no more than once a year.”
Kind of stating the obvious here but BLO is the standard finish of most military rifle stocks. There are exceptions like the Mosin Nagants which have a red shellac and the Japanese Arisaka's which have a finish very difficult to duplicate correctly but if you are seeking original finish, boiled linseed oil is correct.
We aren't dealing with the preservation of furniture here but restoration of military rifle stocks.
The stocks on firearms are often referred to as "furniture". Wood is wood regardless as to whether it is a chair, a boat, a house, or a gun stock it is still susceptible to the same physical changes due to environment changes as any other wooden object. The finish is there to protect the wood against environmental abnormalities.
The original posting was dealing with the preservation of the original finish that he had on his rifle. What has been mentioned here after were suggestions of using everything from Murphy’s Oil Soap to Simple green and OOOO steel or bronze wool, turpentine, alcohol and everything else in between. Many of these materials may be incompatible with the finish he may have on his rifle. Certainly, the abrasive materials suggested are distructive to the originality of the surface.
Below is an excerpt from an article from Wood Magazine June 1989 in which Ron Ashby, a professional woodworker, refinisher, and lecturer, along with Wallace Gusler, are quoted in the uses of paste wax and other products as they relate to wood and their finishes. If you are not familiar with Mr. Gusler and his work, he has held many positions at Colonial Williamsburg including Chief Conservator for Furniture and Arms, and Director of Conservation. He is also a renowned world class Master Gunsmith.
Wax Protection for Furniture
Despite the multitude of furniture care products that promise to "feed" or "polish" your fine furniture, Ashby believes high-quality furniture wax is the best choice. "All the other care products available attract dust with the residue they leave behind," he says. At Virginia's Colonial Williamsburg, Wallace Gusler, director of conservation, oversees the preservation of authentic colonial furniture. "Our primary concern with pieces that have an intact, original finish is conservation," he says. "For that, we use wax. And, Gusler believes, all wood furniture, not just historic pieces, deserves wax protection. "Everyone collects furniture to some extent, he notes, "But their collection happens to be their household furniture."
What about lemon oil, another popular wood-care product? Gusler says, "The value of oil to wood is folklore. Of course, oil gives a wood finish a superficial shine, but it isn't beneficial. In fact," he elaborates, "Commercial lemon oil has nothing to do with lemons. It's essentially kerosene, and can be harmful to a finish."
Then, there are aerosol spray cleaners and polishes that contain silicone. They may not harm the present finish, say Ashby and Gusler, but they will cause problems down the road if you contemplate refinishing. "Products with silicones are cheap, quick, and easy, but they don't protect," comments Ashby. "Besides, silicones make refinishing difficult because, even after stripping, a new finish won't adhere."
In the US, stocks on firearms are rarely called furniture. In the UK, yes. That being said, the title of this thread is "Cleaning an old stock".
You're missing the point, the majority of military rifles original finish is linseed oil. They were dipped in large tanks of it when new. It is easy to maintain and as evidenced by the thousands of military surplus rifles around that have gone through wars and quite a bit of abuse in all types of weather conditions, it protects them very well. In keeping with the originality of the rifle, if it has a linseed oil finish, the proper "new" finish after cleaning is linseed oil. To treat is as something else and use a different type finish makes the rifle less desirable to the collector. Many collectors would prefer no cleaning at all, liking the "grubby" finish. Most don't seem to mind mild cleaning and re-coating with linseed oil and that is where this thread comes in. The cleaning agents have been used, they work and have not detrimentally harmed the wood.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeeDavie41
I believe the drama is that firearms, especially military were absolutely NOT expected to remain in a stable environment. Rain, snow, desert heat, mud, sweat, etc. are all part of the normal working environment. Folk have been using firearms in these conditions since they were invented. One would expect that if a simple wax exterior finish would do the job, then that would be the norm after several hundred years of experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by WeeDavie41
Instead, governments went to considerable expense even post WWII to have their overhaul facilities equiped with large tanks of warm oil, linseed or tung, generally, just to keep their weapons servicable for the maximum length of time in the field.
The US did convert to a tung oil finish in the 20th century, but the British and Commonwealth Nations continued to use raw linseed oil as long as they had wood on their weapons. (Boiled linseed oil was a substitute standard, but it doesn't penetrate as well, and can indeed build up on the surface, so it was not preferred.)
Read some of Peter Laidler's posts on his experiences in the Base Workshops in Malaysia, etc. to get an idea of how well the "inferior" RLO performed in extremely harsh conditions!