finally, attempting to show granddad's "bringback"

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Hi to all, i've been reading and learning but not online everyday. As i said in "new member intro" last year, my grandfather (Ontario Tank Reg't) smuggled back this beauty M1 Carbine along with a Walther PPK (unfortunately stolen in the 80s), both taken from captured Germans approx. Jan 45 after Canadian Army liberated Holland and moved into Germany. He was MQMS (Mechanical Quarter Master Sargeant) and so/somehow escaped scrutiny when returning to Halifax. The story told to my dad was apparently quite a few treasures were tossed overboard in Halifax harbour by the "grunts" when informed thorough checks were in store.
I attempted to take close-up pics but my camera let me down, (even in close-up mode) so i will describe markings. Both it and the SKS remain well hidden due to the reality of living in Canada. We also have a few Lee-Enfields but all have been sporterized.

on barrel behind front sight is;
INLAND MFG. DIV
GENERAL MOTORS
4 - 44

partially obscured under rear sight is;
INLAND DIV (i believe this is what shows)
5270859

rear adjustable sight shows;
IRCO
7160060

mag release stamped;
M

in slingwell and on bottom of top foregrip (4 RIVETS);
IO

stamped on right side of stock is the CARTOUCHE

Note that the sling and stripper clips are from the 60s which Dad picked up while training with Canadian Army in Texas (Artillery, 1SSM Bty.) and the "oiler" is what he whittled from a clothespin. Both items plus a couple extra mags would be nice.
So, check the pics and again i am sorry for poor quality. I am not trying to sell or prove anything and only know what was passed down from my grandfather (passed away in 82) to father to me. This is only to share with likeminded persons and of course i welcome any comments.

Very nice and thanks for sharing your story.

Thanks for posting interesting story,may you enjoy your treasured family heirloom for many years to come.

Blazer91,
There is so much more you could tell us about the current parts on that nice looking carbine. The picture showing the left side of your receiver reveals the two tone color shadow we most often find on original finished metal at this serial range.

But we need more, such as,
Front Sight- marking and type.
More Barrel markings- like the stamped P proof size and location. Markings on the underside barrel flat. Markings on the gas cylinder and end of the gas piston.
Type II Barrel band- Any markings? Or unmarked?
Trigger Housing- Usually marked on the right rear side. Can see the Hammer is a Flat style marked H.I.
Mag Catch- Marked M, but look on the front tooth for more markings.
Stock- Slingwell marking... IO ?
These are just to get you thinking and better yet......... Looking! Face it you've stumbled upon real carbine Junkies!

Don't know if your a member of The Carbine Club, if not......... Look in to joining. A world of knowledge from collectors with hands on experience and the eye for detail. The club asks for every member to contribute info.

In the link below, look near the bottom of the page for the DATA SHEET you can print off a copy and use it to help ID your parts. Best way you can share your carbine with us and ID the parts for yourself.

The Carbine Club - A CMP Affiliated Organization

Looking forward to your parts ID and............ Better Pictures :lol:

Regards,
Charlie-painter777

P.S. A good starter book runs about $25. Written by Craig Riesch. Titled-
U.S. M1 Carbines,
Wartime
Production
6th Edition.
Will help you ID most parts, assist in breakdown and assembly, etc.
Questions? That's what we're here for.

Book Listings-

U.S. M1 Carbine: Wartime Production 6th Edition Book by Craig Riesch


Amazon.com: U.S. M1 Carbines, Wartime Production, 6th Revised and Expanded Edition (9781882391431): Craig Riesch: Books

Hi, thanks for the comments already and yes Painter777, I should and will get a little more serious, just wish it was a little easier up here to do the "club" thing but without getting too political, suffice it to say that this beauty has to stay hidden away.
I just wonder how many other interesting "originals" are out there, stories yet untold (or lost forever) especially here in Canada where jewels like this have to hide.
regards,

Boy, that is one neat Inland! Thanks for sharing the gun and it's history with us. It looks like Charlie missed your "IO" in the slingwell reference, but as you can tell by his informative post, he doesn't usually miss much. Please give us more details and pictures when you get that camera to cooperate. - Bob

I was not sure but now want to add this detail only because I would love to hear " the whole story" and it can be a small world.
On the buttstock is a set of initials starting with H. _._. along with approx. 8 "kill" marks scribed into the wood.
Does anyone know of a relative or friend that may have been captured by the Germans during the "Battle of the Bulge" resulting in this carbine being recovered not long after by Canadian troops?
I know this is a long shot (pardon the pun) but you never know....
regards, Jim

sorry, meant to say "timeframe" of Battle of the Bulge as that is only one possibility even though it is most likely considering the circumstances.
Jim

Jim,
GREAT looking piece of history you have there. I also can't wait to see more pics. realy interested in the initials / "kill marks". Please keep us posted and feed our relentless need for more "Gun Porn".
You may have problems with hiding away some historical toys, but I for one here in the USA wish I had access to your stash of SKS's in the "Great White North". You have two of my favorite rifles.
Fred

OK, for those who want to raise restorations to the next level. Look at the picture of the trigger housing. Notice anything about the pins and safety?

Hi, let me know exactly what you mean, as far as i know this beauty spent most of the time stashed in the ceiling of granddad's old cottage. That's why there are paint specks on the stock (not visible in pics). I know it got to the deer camp in the 50s , just for some fun but for the most part has remained hidden away. I will check with my dad but i'm sure he has told me everything he knows about it. Jim

My take on that comment is that the pins all appear to match - that might be hard to duplicate on a restoration, thereby making a "restorer" have to work a little harder. - Bob

Bob, I took it that Bubba was implying something negative, in a rude way. I said i didn't have anything to prove and i only know what my Dad can tell me but maybe I need to meet up with Badger as he is only a couple hours away. Jim

I think Bubba's an OK guy. Why don't you go ahead and send him a PM. That might be a good way to handle it. Also, Doug (Badger) will usually respond right away to any PM's you send him, even when he's on the road. :thup: - Bob

thanks Bob, think i will send him a note. Since joining last march I have come to learn how big a deal this is, with regard to restoration and deliberate deception.
I can't just haul it out to take more pics as it is still with my father (couple hours further away from Badger) and stashed good. The reality is that it is a "restricted weapon" so it must stay hidden. One blast of politics here, at the risk of censure, in this country we have to secure our weapons and hide them or we face charges, instead of criminals worrying about getting their f^*king heads blown off. But don't worry, I still keep a short barrelled Mossberg at the ready. cheers

My take on Rogers statement,
The wear and color on the pins and safety look original to the trigger housing. All appear to have been tapped in to place with the same type tool. Finish wear circles can be seen under the pins and around the safety ON THE TRIGGER HOUSING

All good things to find!

Charlie-painter777

blazer91 did email me and send me a PM. I will respond here so all can see.

P7, Close, but not wear or color, Something else on a more basic level, machining.

Please look again at the left side view of the trigger housing. I have noticed over the past ten plus years in aquiring "real" original five million and up Inlands, that the pins, safety , and usually recoil plare screw head will have raised up metal in the center. A little ti* (thing on a male hog, not used) as it were. The picture clearly shows this on the trigger housing pin, hammer pin, and safety. The trigger pin could have one but picture is a little fuzzy and it would be small. I have seen trigger pins with the ti* on Inlands and it could be on the other side.

My commit was for would be restorers to look at their work and check the pins. If they do not have this raised up point, they need to get "Inland" pins. A restorer having to get pins with a ti* for his late Inlands, is the new level of which I speak.
Check recoil plate screws for those with raised up metal in the center.
Havind the ti* is another way to spot reproduction safeties. They don't have them as a rule, not fool proof, just something else to look for.

I saw nothing on the pictured carbine to inply it was not what it was thought to be. A very nice carbine. Wonderful it is staying in the family. I have so many that the family thought nothing of and sold. It makes me feel bad for them, of them, I don't know. It makes me sick to see real history on a personal level lost.

If I did not answer all the concerns raised about this carbine, please let me know.

thanks for your obvious expertise, I took your original comment in a negative way and apoligise for going "on the offense". I just wish I was able to get first hand info from my grandfather regarding his experience with this beautiful piece of history. Jim

I see what you mean Roger.
Here's a picture or 2 of the tits on the pins and safety on this one. U flip sight, 3-44 barrel, OI stock channel stamped with the green numbers 80 4, stock made on the 80th day of 1944 per the Julian dating system.
You'll have to look thru the packing grease as this one has been stored away for a few years.

Thx,
Charlie-painter777

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Bubba, great tutorial on the characteristics of the pins and safety. :super:

I checked and my late Inland has all those characteristics as well.

Nice Inland! That's exactly what my 4.927 looked like originally, before the rebuild. It got a round bolt, Type V slide and adjustable sight, plus a refinish. I've kept it that way because after all, those were operational improvements, and of course the carbine can never be original again anyway.

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