Springfield 1873 Trapdoor help please.

I am going to sell these two Trapdoors locally and would like help identifying originality and any parts that are not original to the guns before I do. If my research is correct the full length was made in 1882 and short one in 1879.

My reading tells me that the short one is not and actual carbine because it is shorter than it should be and the serial number is wrong for a carbine. Is it just something that someone put together or were there other shorter Trapdoors made beside the Carbines?

Great site and thanks for any help...Jeff
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Search for "Bannermann". The Bannermann company seems to have bought up all the spare parts stocks when the Trapdoor was taken out of service by the US Army. So if the parts all look original, but the mix of parts is not quite right, then the chances are it could be a Bannermann "bitsa".

Get hold of "The 45-70 Springfield" by Frasca & Hill. If it's not in there, then it's a homebrew gun.

:wave:
Patrick

Thanks, I just recently discovered the Bannermann rifles. I am not sure if I have the correct mix of parts. Even though I plan on selling these I will check Amazon for The 45-70 Springfield, I always like to have reference material. Thanks again...Jeff

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Originally Posted by Inverted99

Even though I plan on selling these I will check Amazon for The 45-70 Springfield, I always like to have reference material.

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Very wise. That way you are better prepared to evaluate a rifle before you buy it!

Very true. For me, half the fun is learning the history on firearms.

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Originally Posted by Inverted99

My reading tells me that the short one is not and actual carbine because it is shorter than it should be and the serial number is wrong for a carbine.

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You don't need to read anything to see that the shorter rifle is just a cut-down. Full-size rifle backsight and no foresight at all = totally useless for aiming and the recoil would be unpleasant. Look for a proper barrel or use it for parts/sell it for parts. Take a close look at the inside of the barrel - has it been used as a shotgun?

:wave:
Patrick

Looks like it very well could have been used as a shotgun, no rifling that I can see using a bore lite. Thanks for that suggestion...Jeff

I have a 64/66 Springfield picked up about 60 years ago that falls right into the Bannerman quagmire. I just started researching it and it's hard to tell a parts gun from a early conversion, regardless the primary reaction when it comes to U.S. Springfield Trapdoors, is their authenticity, and to get a 'realistic' interpretation of the Rifle one would have to consult a Springfield expert....
It did seem that anything post 1870 was 'less likely' to be a Bannermann(specific guy/co in the 50's? that set up shop near the Armoury and bought old stock and put together brand new old guns).
Is there a date on the lock plate, or a different date other than the model number on the trap mech?

Here's mine, re-blued 1950's at Long Branch Arsenals.

Attachment 30304

The short one may be a line throwing gun.

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Originally Posted by Bullseye4mkI*

I have a 64/66 Springfield picked up about 60 years ago that falls right into the Bannerman quagmire. I just started researching it and it's hard to tell a parts gun from a early conversion, regardless the primary reaction when it comes to U.S. Springfield Trapdoors, is their authenticity, and to get a 'realistic' interpretation of the Rifle one would have to consult a Springfield expert....
It did seem that anything post 1870 was 'less likely' to be a Bannermann(specific guy/co in the 50's? that set up shop near the Armoury and bought old stock and put together brand new old guns).
Is there a date on the lock plate, or a different date other than the model number on the trap mech?

Here's mine, re-blued 1950's at Long Branch Arsenals.

Attachment 30304

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Been busy for a couple of days and didn't check my posts. Thanks for the additional information, there is no date on the lock plate, the only date is on top of the trap mechanism. I think I will buy the book so I can see if it has all original parts before I put it up for sale. Nice looking rifle, thanks...Jeff

---------- Post added at 05:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:36 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by musketshooter

The short one may be a line throwing gun.

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I could not think of what they were called but remembered hearing something about them. Any idea where I can find more information on those...off to Google. Thanks...Jeff

Hey Jeff, I think Musket made the perfect call. Just google 'Trapdoor Line throwing...'
I found a few up for auction and on or two complete boxed sets with accoutrements,
interesting rifle for sure...
I also found reference to one being brought in to the show "Pawnstars"(ep155), which might be an interesting source of info.

Attachment 30565

Thanks Bullseye4mkI*. I was able to locate a ton of information, isn't the internet a great thing? It was a line throwing gun, too bad I didn't have the complete kit, it was in very good condition though. I traded both guns about a week ago, just wanted to update. Thanks for all the help...Jeff

Did you trade them for another gun or something else?

Well it was a multiple gun trade with two different people. For those two guns plus an M1 Garand I came home with two quality AR-15's, a WWI Colt M1911 (will keep my WWII M1911A1 company in the safe), 1000 rounds of .223 and $200.00. The other deal I traded an M1 Carbine for a beautiful Remington 700BDL and $400.00.