Fake WRA/GHD on sales board

Well I contacted the seller as I was asked to verify this stock. He has ignored me totally so I best help here.

It is a West coast forgery and as you can see below it has the same fake Ordnance wheel as the fake NFR has. Barry Redding tried to pass these off years ago and was buying from Karl Krause who has been a long time forger. Be careful folks. Rick B

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...mattpalm-1.jpg

---------- Post added at 09:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:07 AM ----------

Here is another of these fakes. The key is the Looney Tune style cannons and the large squarer G. The H is larger and the D extends forward a bit more. They got this one close and years ago it fooled me on faint ones. Once I started seeing the same cannons show up on other SA examples I realized a closer look was needed. These have been around for about 10 years now. Rick B

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ohnwyatt-1.jpg

---------- Post added at 09:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:16 AM ----------

One more from the Barry Redding / Karl Krause collection of fakes. Rick B


https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...kewraghd-1.jpg

Rick thank you for posting this important information. This is great information and I don't think any of the legitimate collectors here would ever want to see one of their own get burned. It does happen of course but thanks to you and a few other great folks who post on this site it lessens the risk. :super:

I was happy to see the owner emailed me and pulled the add. A big thanks to him. EMail below. Rick B



Rick, thanks for your input, you are correct, much to my dissappointment. Bought this from a reputable stock source at a GCA convention in 2001. I was told that the stamp (F140) on the end of the ferrule was common to WRA only. I will pull add on the site, never intended to defraud anyone.

thanks again,

Bob

Perfect ending to this. No one hurt, no one taken! Kudos to the seller and kudos to you as well Rick. So, two :super: up!

Jeepers Rick,They look so close!I would be fooled in a heartbeat!!!

Prince, most would including me. ;)

Again this worries me. When it comes time to finally part with my one collector piece(LL from SA) there'll be so many fakes out there and they'll be good. Then I'll be hooped trying to sell a good one. No one will believe it's real.

I will Jim :)

It's hard to tell the difference when looking at them side by side. I can't imagine being at a gun show and telling the difference. I'm well aware of all the faking, but they seem to be getting better at it.

Thanks for the heads up.

They have gotten good at the Winchester GHD because it doesn't have allot of curves in it. The Springfield stamps are a bit tougher with the S's and there cannons are very firm and not cartoon like. It is only a matter of time but they will still leave subtle things I hope I can still find. The problem is I never know when I am verifying a stock for someone if it is a forger asking for me to tell them why I find it fake only to fix that issue. Rick B

Rick has help me on two stocks over the years
For that I am i debt to him
All the faking along with the pricing is one reason I have very little interest in buying any other wood or restoring any other rifles
I would much rather shoot them and buy power/primer and bullets

Yes, Rick, that's always the dilemma -- if you tell them what's wrong they will make the next ones better. The consolation is that you have made one whole generation of fakes unsaleable and one stamp useless, like the Snoopy DAS :)

I'm thinking the limit on good fakes will eventually be only the raw material on which to stamp them. Nice GI walnut is getting very scarce.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bob seijas

I'm thinking the limit on good fakes will eventually be only the raw material on which to stamp them. Nice GI walnut is getting very scarce.

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Before one of the local army surplus store owners passed away, I had asked him if he ever got any old M1 Garand or M14 stocks to sell.
He just smiled, paused a second, and said "son, a long time ago" the Army trucks lined up out here in my driveway, and dropped off one dump-truck load of them things after the other. There were several dump truck loads, "just piled up out there, smothered in cosmoline"
Now there was no way in hell, He said, that I could ever put that many stocks in my store for sale, or in my garage, or anywhere for that matter.
He said I even tried giving some away, but back then, after the war, nobody wanted that many of them.
"So I asked kindly," well what did you do with all of them? He said...much to my suprise..."They sure did burn good" with all that cosmoline in em!
So I guess things like that, are exactly why there arent more good original WW2 GI stocks left around anywhere anymore. "SAD, but TRUE"......HILLBILLY-06.

Unfortunately, with something that's not serialized (and even some things that are), eventually it may become impossible to tell a fake from the real thing. I've been around things like high-dollar Guitars, Guns, Knives and various other collectibles and antiques my whole life. I'm pretty good with some of them but not all. Being around collectibles so long has made me realize something I was told by a very wealthy Guitar collector is absolutely true... "If the experts can't tell it's a fake, it's not a fake." This man showed me a very nice looking '59 Flame-top Gibson Les Paul at a guitar show that many articles were written about because of how it turned up after years of being in storage. At the time I believe it was valued at around $150,000.00. All of the top Gibson guys authenticated it. Problem is, he knows it's a fake... because he knows the guy who built it. He even saw the guitar at various stages of completion. I asked him why he didn't blow the wistle on it. He said he did... for several years... It was owned by some very respected collectors over those several years and people decided to believe the guys who spent hunderds-of-thousands-of-dollars on it rather than the eyewitness. Finally, he gave up.

The guy that built the guitar had died of Cancer. He built several other great copies but always marked his work very inconspicuously so it could never be mistaken for the real thing... and because he was proud of his work. For some reason this particular Les Paul was never marked. He probably just never got around to it. His family apparently sold the guitar after he died and the truth died with him.

OH... and FYI... There's apparently a "Real" DoD Garand stamp for sale on Ebay right now for $250.00!!! Not one of those cheapies mounted on wood. This one looks like the real deal... But I can't tell!

Been there and done that. I was burned at the stake a few times when I turned over forgeries. The biggest problem I see are those who own something refusing to say it is a fake.

I learned over time to show a comparison which leaves no doubt and then let the owner or buyer go about there merry way. I cannot stop starvation in other countries nor can I loose sleep over it. Same goes for all other things counting forgeries. I can point it out and let that person do as they feel.


My name took allot of heat when I used to argue over everything I thought I could change. Best thing I did was argued back then so I would be smarter today from burning myself. Rick B

"None so blind as those who WILL not see."