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Tearing it down and doing a complete inspection and cleaning as I always do on new milsurps. Do you think I should take the stock off as well?
I usually leave the butt stocks on a MK1 and dont usually take things like front sights off. I dont really see any point in taking them off.
But I usually dont take the butt stocks off a MK1 and I think this time I will.
Better still, just clean it externally, view and gauge the bore and headspace, ensure that the bolt is numbered to the rifle then take it to the range. See how it shoots first and if it's getting a group of 5 shots inside or cutting a rectangle 1" horizontal x 1.5" vertical at 25 yards with only the fore-arm resting, it shows that all is well. And if it is, then leave it alone!
If it's all greased up under the wood, then leave it. It's there for a good reason
What he says ^^^^^^^^ :):)
Ok all apart and cleaned up nicely. A lot of crudded up crusty cosmo on this one. A wonder it still functioned. Now to oil it all up and put her back together when its dry. Probably after I get home from work.
Umm why would I take the grease of the bottom of the barrel???
Unless it was cruddy old cosmoline why would I do that?
In this case not needed. I checked it looks fine. Would be just more work re-greasing it.
---------- Post added at 03:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:26 PM ----------
Ok and now the wood. Anyone have a really good way to clean but not refinish wood?
:madsmile:Why would you take the grease off the bottom of the barrel? To see whats underneath. Nothing wrong with taking it off as long as you put it back before reassembly.
If you look in the Restorers Corner Forum you'll find more info on cleaning stocks than you can shake a stick at..............
You ask '......why would I take the grease.........'
I answer, I don't know why anyone would, but they all seem to do so, so I just politely suggested that you leave it
Its all about condensation and the rifles internal humidity and slowing the onset of invisible corrosion, rust never sleeps, grease is good, sounds like pop song for enfielders.
Just put music to that and I'll buy a copy.
"Clean me, why won't you clean me?, come on and clean me, before you put me on the shelf"
sorry, got carried away.
So you think I should take that grease off and check it before I re grease and reassemble?
I usually dont with the thinking that it should be good if it has grease on it.
I havent started any reassemble yet so could still do it.
I love taking these rifles apart and seeing how they work. Dont you guys?
Get em all cleaned up before I take em out and dirty them again.
Heck I was taking apart the M1 Carbine bolts by hand and reassembling them before I even knew there was a jig to make it easier.
Umm actually if you put oil on rust it does make it sleep. Iron rust is oxidation. It needs three things for it to happen . Iron or Iron based metal, Humidity or water, and air. If you cover rust with oil it will make it sleep at least until the oil disseminates enough to allow air to reach the oxidation again.
In a word....no ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt Mil Coll
We did an 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it' thread only a week or two ago ;)
OK well obviously this thread is about people who like to tear down and clean and inspect their rifles. If you dont thats fine. But I happen to find it fascinating to see how these old Battle Rifles work.
So didnt get an answer on the grease on the bottom so I took it off inspected it and regreased it. A waste of time if you ask me but I did it. Strange how most rifles dont require something like that but hey this is an English rifle after all.
Reassembling now and it looks good. Used the method that I always do for the stocks. Cleans that old oil and dirt out of the wood without refinishing it. Gives it a really deep deep luster too.
Will take it to the range tomorrow and see what it does.
I just spent $$$$s on a 1935 MkIII Lithgow, all looks good, washer still covering stockbolt, at this point people would be saying "it ain't broke, don't fix it"
Well i took it apart as you never know what idiot has been there before, guess what!
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ithgow11-1.jpg
Thats right! some moron has tried to undo the stockbolt with the forend in place:(
Its all very well trying to tell people to leave rifles alone if they look fine in an attempt to stop this type of crap from happening, but unfortunately that boat has long sailed.
That damage was caused by not knowing "how" to take the rifle apart. If you had not disassembled the rifle you would not have known this damage occurred, good reason the check. I'm with Capt Mil Coll on a complete disassembly and clean & inspect of any used or new fire arm I buy.Quote:
Originally Posted by 5thBatt
A third of the LE's I have bought needed a new trigger because bubba was there first. I like my equipment to function correct before I'm off to the great north woods. It's just a personal choice.
EXACTLY the point madcrate builder..... If it ain't broke, then don't fix it. :banghead: 5th Batt has to fix it because someone broke it in the first place ...... and the PREVIOUS owner broke it because it didn't NEED fixing.............. To be honest 5th Batt, that's the mildest bit of bubbaing I have ever seen. The tinkerer realised that the stock bolt was tight and stepped back, before he got to the point of no return.
I know I'm repeating myself but Ian Skennerton's little Small Arms ID booklets should be required reading for every new owner of any LE rifle. They all have a short chapter on disassembly which eliminates these mistakes if taken to heart. Of course, they're the big pricey sum of $10 and why buy one when you can get free information or a download from the internet. Sorry for being a bit old fashioned but I happen to have about four SMLE forends here that are worse than that one for the same reason. ALL will have to be patched before the rifles can be offered for sale which is a time consuming and tedious job. I don't just sell them on like most people do knowing they're broken. Buy a friggin' book before you get out the tool box! Ho hum.
Well again. This thread is about tearing the rifles down and cleaning and inspecting them as a first step. I dont know why you keep posting your if it aint broke dont fix it. Quite a few of us have learned through purchasing many many many different types, models, variations, manufacturers, years, calibers, usage, new and used rifles that safe is always better than sorry. I have been to the range with rifles that wouldnt function because the ejector was full of dry cosmo. Or the op rod spring was too old to function.
A lot of experienced people tear their rifles down and do a clean and inspection before taking them to the range. You say its stupid to do so. I say from experience its stupid not to.
And a lot of inexperieced people will tear them down and break 'em in the process!! Hell, I've had woodwork just fall apart from disassembly and if they'd been left alone, they might not have. There has to be some common sense someplace. If the rifles look good, check out with gauges, function properly, and aren't devoid of grease and lubrication, by all means, just make sure the screws are tight and shoot them. If not, will the inexperienced among us, please buy a book first and learn some of the simple little tips before you dive in. 'Nuff said from me!
We were going through a similar thread to this before you were even on the forum Cap'n and to cut to the quick, I've been fixing many, many, many broke rifles for so looooooong, that my head hurts just thinking about it.
I think that these forums are a good place to listen to what we call 'the wisdom of the crowd' and believe me, THIS particular crowd on this fdorum have plenty of wisdom. I've got to confess that I read and ignore some of the old horse manure and ain't afraid to tell you that I'm STILL learning from others.
You're in more danger from an accident in your car than your rifle blowing up on the range. But when did you do more than check the tyres, look at the suspension ands check over the free play in the brakes when you bought your last used car? If you give me some glib answer, then just think that the next question is going to be 'but did you strip that right down........., just to learn how it works'!
I've had a bit of a sheltered life, ain't lived much, ain't done nothing much either but tinkerers and enthusiastic amateurs have been and are the bane of Armourers (and everyone else, but I only know about Armourers) lives. As I always say, in my limited experience........ oh, I won't even repeat it! But time for a cool beer as it's another busy day at the Armourers shops tomorrow
Yes, with good 'ol e-bay there's no excuse for not having a book or two to help do proper things properly. And, of course, common sense- my immaculate MLE is not going to be touched by a screwdriver (unless someday I decide I want to see how it shoots!). If you collect and shoot these old machines you will very very probably end up "tinkering". A bit like my small fleet of british bikes- in Calgary today, if you want to run a 68 Bonneville you have to be your own mechanic and learn what it takes. I won't even get into my Norton Commando.
Ridolpho
Just another Armourers comment......give over, this is all getting repetetive and boring.
Those of us that know what to do, will just keep fixing your f....ups, 'cause that's what we do.
Nice.
Oh by the way. Back to what I was talking about before I was so rudely interupted. Got the old rifle put back together. Clean. Shiney. Functions flawlessly. Took it out fired it. Works as good as an Enfield should. So will clean it and go on to the next one.
Thank you all to your insightful comments about what to look for in a complete disassembly. It was about the 15th Ive done on Enfields.
You can call it 'rude interruption' but this is clearly a 'trolling' thread in protest at suggestions in the other thread - only no-one's allowed to disagree with you because you started it. Respect the opinions of some great experts on this forum. Anyone can have a different point of view, but saying 'you can't post here' is just pathetic.
It does seem Capt Mil Coll is upset with those of us who advised a Lee-Enfield novice not to disassemble his newly-acquired No.4 Mk.2 without a sound reason and detailed instructions. His first response on that topic shows some annoyance -
". . . As for the "I can do it but your too stupid to do it" people mouthing off, all I can say is its a firearm not a rocket. I can tear down and fix a PC with no problem. I can tear down and fix a car with no problem. Why the hell cant I tear down and fix a rifle? Give me a break." Capt Mil Coll, 5/26/2012
I think he misses something many might find obvious: individuals have very different aptitudes and skills. Some fine folks, for instance, have difficulty writing English and simply don't grasp basic concepts like the difference between "your" and "you're" or "its" and "it's" - others find removing L-E wood without damage a difficult challenge.
The original poster on that other thread asked "How far should I disassemble my Enfield before taking it to the range the 1st time?" and it was evident from his post that his experience with Lee-Enfields is limited. Had he asked us how to disassemble it rather than "How far should I . . .," the responses would likely have been very different.
Perhaps the main thrust of Mil Coll's posts is just to boast about his technical skills. That's fine - but neither helpful nor interesting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by muffett.2008
No you won't, because you are 10000000s of miles way. And Peter Laidler is on the wrong side of the channel, from my point of view. Possibly the only rifle shooter in Mauserland who can make something esoteric like a BA or BSF bolt is writing this post right now. I (and many others) have to rely on myself, my workshop, and hard acquired know-how too keep my old bangers in order. It would be fine if we could all use the services of experienced armorers. But we can't, and if everyone who needed something fixing on his rifle were to knock on your door, you wouldn't get much sleep!
I appreciate that you may have truly expert knowledge and ability. But that is no reason to talk down to the rest of us.
:wave:
Patrick Chadwick
Bugger, I've been rouse'd on,:crying: is the world really that big Patrick?:yikes:
That figure is more like the amount of active and ex armourers in the world, :dancingbanana:I'm sure that you are not alone in your neck of the woods.
:bash: But if the end result is that it brings a close to this thread, that would be good.
(This is a tongue in cheek comment, for those with no sense of humour.)
I find it important to take at least the forend off (especially on No1s) you just never know what you'll find missing such as the forend stud & spring or front trigger guard collar plus any damage or active rust, who know what you may also find that should not be there, such as bits of credit cards, coke cans, a roll of masking tape & maybe even an old pair of socks.
Im very impressed with the posts of those of us who feel a rifle can be dangerous and should have a good inspection and cleaning before takiing it out to fire.
Dont know why some feel this thread is not important but I am a firm believer in taking down and cleaning every firearm I get.
So on to the Garand someone left in their basement for 30 some years.
When I got it for $100.00 the bolt wouldnt even open on it.
Maybe Ill start a thread on that and post pics.
OK then we are drifting a bit off point here. From the looks of it we have two apposed views on how much maintenance is needed before a rifle is taken to the range for the first time. As has been said so many times in the past “it’s your rifle do as you please”. As this thread is for the most part a duplicate of the previous one I’m not sure much more can be gained by debating the points further.
Quote:
Originally Posted by No4Mk1(T)
Aren't you overlooking the entertainment factor?:lol:
But seriously, “it’s your rifle do as you please” is not good enough. Whoever takes a rifle to a range has a duty to make sure that it is safe. And thus to carry out as much dismantling and inspection as is necessary for that purpose. Or, failing the appropriate knowhow, to have it done by a competent person.
:wave:
Patrick
Well gotta admit I was entertained by this thread. But I did learn some things about Enfields as well. But really bottom line is that a regular guy can take down his rifles if he has some common sense and the forethought to get some intel on how to do it.
Its only a rifle. Not rocket science.