M1 Carbine Feeding Like Molasses or Not At All

I recently purchased a 1944 Inland M1 Carbine which I have not fired yet. With an empty mag or no mag at all, the bolt seems to function in good order. When I placed a loaded mag in the gun and manually functioned the bolt only about 20% of the rounds will load into the chamber far enough for the gun to go into battery and many of those don't even come close. I have tried the mag that came with the gun (I believe it is USGI) as well as a new after market mag from Brownell's; I have also tried two different types of ammunition no of which have resulted in any improvement.

I've been looking around on this site and elsewhere but haven't been able to find anything helpful. I'm hoping that someone on this forum can help solve my problem or direct me to somewhere that can.

Thanks,
Jeff

Take a look at the gas tappet piston and make sure it moves freely. You will need the special wrench to remove the piston if it is binding.

First, welcome to the site! Ah, SCUBA! My PADI instructors number is OWSI 33300. :)

Second, change the magazine if you have another. If not, pull the floor plate off the magazine, clean it very good and lightly (LIGHTLY) oil the inside and follower. Check to make sure the sides are not bent inward causing the follower to bind. Make sure the lips of the magazine are not bent inward causing too much drag on the round being picked up (how difficult does the round slide forward out of the magazine). If they are bent you may choose to bend them back out however if this is something you have not done be careful and don't bend too much. Use wide duckbill pliers so that you bend evenly. If you don't feel comfortable doing this then don't. This can be tricky getting it just right. Next, pull the slide and spring/spring guide assembly and clean very good. Dab some grease on the contact points with a Q-Tip. If this doesn't work you may need a new spring.

Jeff,
Where are you in Michigan?
You can send me a E-mail or private message if you'd prefer.

Charlie-painter777
Williamston, MI

I'd pull the bolt out. While out see if the bottom tail of the firing pin slides freely in the bottom slot, Next, I'd try cleaning/de-greasing the bolt. The Extractor may be jammed up.
Spray de-grease, blow dry and lube.
Look for large burrs on either of the bolts lugs.
Also check the feed ramp to see if it is scarred up or rough.
Pretty common to get froze up bolts from being stored a long time with packing grease hardened up.

If you've tried multiple mags and a couple types of ammo. I tend to think it's a bolt gummed up issue.
Easy enough to clean, then eliminate it, if not the problem.

This picture shows the Extractor, and the flat part of the plunger setting on the extractors ledge. You should be able to pry it back and forth. If not it's gummed up, or might have a jammed/broken plunger behind it.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC06041-1.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by scubatke

I recently purchased a 1944 Inland M1 Carbine which I have not fired yet. With an empty mag or no mag at all, the bolt seems to function in good order. When I placed a loaded mag in the gun and manually functioned the bolt only about 20% of the rounds will load into the chamber far enough for the gun to go into battery and many of those don't even come close. I have tried the mag that came with the gun (I believe it is USGI) as well as a new after market mag from Brownell's; I have also tried two different types of ammunition no of which have resulted in any improvement.

I've been looking around on this site and elsewhere but haven't been able to find anything helpful. I'm hoping that someone on this forum can help solve my problem or direct me to somewhere that can.

Thanks,
Jeff

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The loading procedure is; lock a loaded mag into the carbine; draw back the slide all the way and release it. Your post leads me to believe you are 'riding' the slide to let it close slowly. Other than that, any gun 'new to you' should be thoroughly 'G.I.d' before shooting. If you can't take the bolt apart at this time, at least soak it in penetrant and make sure the ejector and extractor move and has spring tension and the firing pin shakes. Then oil the bolt. Your recoil spring might be weak or gummed up. Generally a stuck gas piston will be found pushed all the way in, so its not likely that its causing loading problems. Most of the time the first round fired will loosen the gas piston. You can spray it with brake cleaner and move it in and out with a magnet to help clean it. The excess solvent will run down the gas port and out the barrel, taking any oil with it, so oil the barrel afterwards.
Clean the barrel and chamber with bore cleaner and a bronze brush. That should absolutely be the first thing done before trying to load.

scubatke,

You live close to Charlie (painter 777) maybe you can get some help from him.

Jim

Wow...thanks for all of the replies!

Everything seems very loose and operating well when the mag is empty or removed; the problem does not appear on the last 5-7 rounds in a mag. No, I am not riding the slide.

The hang up seems to be happening before the chamber and I noticed that when it does not go into battery, some of the time I can not assist the bolt forward (it seems like a hard stop). When the rounds load and the gun goes into battery the extractor works well. On the ones that don't go into battery, the extractor is not engaged and won't extract the round. Is the extractor supposed to engage when the bolt rotates into battery or before?

I will take the gun down and do a through cleaning as well as replace the recoil spring. Any suggestions on obtaining a recoil spring?

I'm in Brighton, MI. I wouldn't want to impose on anyone but if someone is close by and interested in helping/schooling me I would appreciate it.

Jeff

Jeff,
I'm west of you @ the Williamston exit (I-96) Then about 5 minutes to the house, 4-5 miles from the exit.
I'd guess ~45 minutes from you.
Be happy to help.
I would have the extra parts here, if needed. Also have bolt tools for proper take down.
You can E-mail me by clicking on my member/user name.

Hth,
Charlie-painter777

Good looking out Charlie! That is what this site is all about :super:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by painter777

Jeff,
I'm west of you @ the Williamston exit (I-96) Then about 5 minutes to the house, 4-5 miles from the exit.
I'd guess ~45 minutes from you.
Be happy to help.
I would have the extra parts here, if needed. Also have bolt tools for proper take down.
You can E-mail me by clicking on my member/user name.

Hth,
Charlie-painter777

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bill ricca might have an op slide spring. I don't know his website, let me see.......

http://www.billricca.com/carbine.htm

I have a feeling scubatke, Will have most of the ammo he owns spent down range this weekend.... :thup:

Cheers,
Charlie-painter777

You can't leave it at that. What was the issue?

Yeah, what the heck Charlie;)

:D
I'll report after hearing how his range session goes.

Cheers,
Charlie-painter777

Here's a few pictures of scubatke's stock.
It has the RMC in the slingwell with the Flaming bomb. I cut to low wood, NO Rebuild stamps, though it has all the late mods, except the Lube/drain hole on the housing.
Has the early QHMC Big Wheel Cartouche.
Not my best pictures........

About the stock.... This is a CAI Import, On the left side of the stock a 2 mil serial number is stamped, just past the stock's comb, just past that is the current actions serial number.

Question, Do you think the markings are from Greece, Italy or Israel..... or ?
Little help here Range Master!!

Thx,
CH-P777

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC09225-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC09226-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC09231-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC09229-1.jpg

My guess is Israel. I think I see a faint s/n underneath the current one. I have one stock that had a number stamped just behind the comb and they sanded it out (left a "dished" spot) before stamping the second number right where scubatke's current number is. The ones I've seen have a little more white paint in them than his. Did you change out his operating slide spring? - Bob

Sorry to keep everyone in suspense! First off...thanks! When I originally posted on this forum I wasn't sure I would get ANY responses much less the overwhelming number of responses and help that I received....thanks to everyone who responded! Also, thanks to everyone who is part of this forum and has been part of creating, developing and maintaining a great group of people. :clap:

Big thanks to charlie-painter777!!! Charlie killed most of his day Friday going over all of the details of my gun with me (and cleaning it for me in the process). It was fascinating and I enjoyed my visit a great deal! I think that the cleaning certainly helped solve my problem but Charlie was right in an earlier post in that we found the flat spot on the extractor plunger was rotated 180 degrees out of position. :bow:

I took the rifle to the range yesterday and my son and I had a blast with not a single problem! Well...there was one problem...I thought 100 rounds of ammo would be plenty! :D

I loved the distinctive report the carbine makes when fired! As you can see in the image below, we're not going to qualify for any marksmanship awards but we had a great time and I'm looking forward to going again and taking my daughter. I shot the first clip on the right and my son shot the second clip on the left, both at 50 yards (maybe I should have used a larger target).

BTW ch777...I tried ALL of the clips and didn't have any issues from ANY of them. "Just shoot it!"

Once again, big thanks to charlie and everyone else!
Jeff

Attachment 35551Attachment 35552

There's only 10 holes on the left. You could give your son a full magazine? :lol:

scubatke,

Thanks for the great follow up! That sure looks like a nice range - we have nothing that nice available where I live. My two oldest Grandsons (13 & 15) visited today and we had planned to shoot .22's a bit, but decided instead to try learning to ride Grandpa's Honda 3-wheeler. That kept us busy and entertained long enough that we didn't get around to the shooting. After a bit more practice with the .22's, I want to let them shoot one of the carbines. I just obtained a 5 round clip with a "hold open" follower that should work great for the training and eliminate that problem of not knowing for sure if the clip is empty, or there was a failure to fire. I went through 6 boxes of ammo in the last week with my IBM, and totally agree about how fast the ammo goes when guys are having fun! - Bob

KEERRR KLUUNNNKKK....... KEERRR KLUUNNNKKK !!

Jeff,
THx for the kind words.
Seeing your son with carbine in hand makes it all worth it.
Now he needs his own !
Was nice meeting you, look forward to seeing you again.
Did you make the Novi show?

BTW,
Jeff graduated from the High School my Father in Law taught wood shop at, it is a small world.

Cheers,
Charlie-painter777

This is great news. Charlie, thank you for helping out one of fellas! :super:

Israeli stock numbering, and I've never seen one with multiple serial numbers. Looks to me like it had at least three different carbines in that stock.

I-44,
I could feel why,
Stock has the heavy/stout feeling to it....
Much like the gals we have here in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan ;-)

CH-P777

JimF...my son is SURE that several shots passed through holes from previous shots! ;) He hasn't shot rifles a lot and was a little intimidated at first. He flinched big time for the first few shots but then settled right in and did well. I have to admit, at 50 yards the target was pretty small when looking down the sights.

USGI...I think that picture captures the 50 yard range at it's best. Interestingly, I just found out on Sunday that those shooting benches were actually done by some Boy Scouts (might have been an Eagle Scout project). They did a great job. I am very fortunate; there are three gun clubs within roughly 20-25 minutes of me. It was hard choosing just one!

C777...I took my wife to her first gun show on Saturday and I think she enjoyed it. We spent most of our time letting her handle a variety of hand guns to try to get an idea of what feels good to her but I managed to look at some carbines as well. I probably missed a few but the only mags I saw were the new (Korean?) ones.

USGI/I44...interesting info on the stock numbering being from Israel. Any suggestions for reading a little more about this?

-ScubaTKE

scubatke,

Maybe I44 can help more on the stock number thing. Possibly you can find more with searches here on the forum for Century Arms, C.A.I., CAI, or something similar. The CMP forums would be a good bet too, as well as Google, etc. About all I know about them is what I've seen in stores and at gun shows where they've had CAI imported carbines. I own a CAI IBM carbine and have one other stock that came off of one. I have to admit that most of them are not near as nice as yours. - Bob

Quote:

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Originally Posted by scubatke

we're not going to qualify for any marksmanship awards

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I wouldn't want to be the Nazi either of you were aiming at!!!!! Congrats.

Probably an Israeli Mash Az volunteer police weapon, based on the serial number stamping on the left side of the stock, and the fact it is a CAI import. Look on the top of the barrel under the handguard and see if you see a very tiny stamp that looks almost like a "4" with the top open. It should be on top, but I have also seen it on the bottom flat of the barrel. Mash Az are like volunteer neighborhood watch with guns. For years, USGI carbines were their standard issue. The Israelis take AWESOME care of their weapons. Replacement parts used by them would be USGI. I missed it if the serial number on the stock is the same as the weapon. That is a plus.

There should be traces of white paint in the serial number stampings, and maybe even traces of black paint on the front sight or other nooks and crannies. They sometimes painted the metal on the carbines black, like Sten guns, and Uzis. I had an Underwood Mash Az that was almost as good of a shooter as my Inland.

Pic attached is from the top of the barrel...is that a 'P' or the character (Hebrew?) that rangemaster mentioned above?

Heading the the range...I'll try to post more later...

That's the P. That's not what he's talking about. Looks like an upside down "h" with a decoration...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

That's the P. That's not what he's talking about. Looks like an upside down "h" with a decoration...

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Thanks! That is a better way of describing it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by imarangemaster

Originally Posted by browningautorifle
That's the P. That's not what he's talking about. Looks like an upside down "h" with a decoration...
Thanks! That is a better way of describing it.

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I'd like to see a picture, if one of you guys have one. Thanks! - Bob

I'm thinking it has to come off one of your rifles...I can't seem to find it on the internet. I don't think it's part of the alphabet. I'm sure it was on the '98 mauser I had too.

My original thred on the topic from 3 years ago. I tried to find the original web page with the info, but didn't

Israeli proof marks?