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I read that with the very early Ithaca 1911A1 production they received slides from Colt. I found here a 1911A1 that should be a Colt but the frame wears the FJA (which is Ithaca) numbered in the 856xxx being duplicated with Colt numbers, on left side of the slide the marking is Colt standard like any Colt 1911A1 WWII, Coltwood plastic grips with no reinforcing rings, hammer wide spur.
Is it genuine or this is a later assembling, have you seen such gun.
We need to see some photos. Ithaca started with s/n 856405. That sounds like a very early Ithaca. Thanks.
In initial production Ithaca used some Model 1911 receivers that came from Springfield Armory. After these were used Ithaca was still having production difficulties, and they purchased some 7000 receivers and 2200 slides from Colt. These were new production parts with no markings, and they were marked by Ithaca. Yours just happens to have a Colt marked slide which was assembled to the pistol later in it's life.
That's what I thought I'ts an assembled pistol, I did not saw it, the seller just send those pictures not too good. I'm not sure how to post picture I try.
ImageShack - Online Photo and Video Hosting
ImageShack - Online Photo and Video Hosting
ImageShack - Online Photo and Video Hosting
The pistol is not original that way. It originally had an Ithaca upper, not Colt. The slide (at least) appears to be refinished. Can't see the receiver well enough to say what finish it is, but it was originally Du-Lite blue. That is a really early Ithaca lower. Thanks.
Again
http://http://imageshack.us/photo/my.../l1020428.jpg/
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...020427th-1.jpg
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---------- Post added at 07:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:01 PM ----------
Thanks Scott,
But I do not know how to post pictures I try with imageShack, I have to try something else.
Try reading the help threads.... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikecp
How do I show pics from Photobucket, Flickr, ImageShack etc. on milsurps.com?
Regards,
Doug
Thanks for your help to post Pictures.
Well, thanks for your infos, you're right this 1911 has been reassembled at some times. The seller told me by phone that indeed the inspector initials is FJA This gun could be good to use it for spare parts, or a shooter as well.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...l1020426-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...l1020427-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...l1020428-1.jpg
The seller told me this gun comes from the Ardennes area is also well known because of the Battle of the Bulge. Well, difficult to know where is the truth!
What are the marks on the right side of the slide and receiver toward the back?
Attachment 35665
I saw this mark somewhere, but I can't remember where, I checked all European proof marks but no success.
The picture is not too good and I don't have access to this gun. I'm not sure to buy this gun yet, maybe as a shooter.
For your information maybe you know that: Switzerland is the only country in Europe when guns are imported from any countries in the world to don't pass at the proofing bench and have those ugly stamps on a cylinder, barrel, and elsewhere. Imagine a beautiful Colt Python stamping all over the gun! I do not know the reason maybe some of you has an explanation.
Hi Mikecp,
Are you considering to buy this 1911A1? If so I wouldn't worry too much about the gun being a mixmaster, it's quite common for the 1911A1's you find on our side of the big pond. It's hard to tell when the changes have been made, it coud have been the GI that was issued the pistol during the war, it could have been the divisional armoury......but it could aso have been post war changes made by the US Army, hard to tel with the pictures at hand! What is the going rate for a 1911A1 in Switzerland, in some european countries prices are going crazy! :-(
Being the 491st Ithaca made makes it too valuable to sell of as parts. Someone probably looked at one of the old serial number lists, and possibly replaced the correct slide thinking the pistol was a Colt.
Well! About prizes of 1911A1, it depends the condition, I would say between CHF 1000.00 to 1500.00, and around 1600.00 for an US&S.
(1000.00 Swiss Francs for $ 1,032.91)
I saw on the net several pistols with frames Ithaca FJA topped with a regular M1911A1 colt marking slide and spur hammer. Some said It's rare I do not know what's the truth.
As you said in the duplicates serial numbers sequences that could be taken for a Colt, that is the reason why we find such assembling. Some people aren't probably aware what means Initials FJA or others.
The truth is that no Ithaca pistols were assembled with Colt marked slides. As posted above, the Colt slides purchased by Ithaca were new production and unmarked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikecp
Not only are slides swapped due to the duplicated serial ranges, but because some people believe it will boost value having a "Colt" instead of an Ithaca. As early as that Ithaca is, if the receiver is all correct, I'd probably try to mate up a correct Ithaca slide to it. The proof marks on the slide and receiver make that a bit of a problem now, as you'd probably never come up with a proper slide having the same proof marks.
However, mating up slides isn't as easy as it sounds, either. Not only would you need a matching finish and proper proof mark, but you'd also have to have matching "P" proofs. All that adds up to about a 0% chance of ever correcting the mismatch. With that in mind, all you can say is "that's too bad it got mismatched". It's just one more very early Ithaca we know isn't original anymore.
Thanks for sharing the images with us.
Thanks for your reply, that's what I thought too.
For my knowledge on M1911A1 I have the book of Mr. Joe Poyer " The Model 1911 and model 1911A1 Military and commercial Pistols" a book of 522 page, as well as the collector's Guide wrote by Charles W. Clawson a book of 146 pages. I'd like to find even used one the largest book of Mr clawson "Colt .45 Service Pistols, Models of 1911 and 1911A1 By Charles W. Clawson copyright 1991. But the prize is prohibitive on eBay around 700.00 bucks. Is there another way to get this book with a more reasonable prize?
Thanks for help.
I find them now and then. I normally sell them for about $600.
You're right Scott, that's what I wrote before that gun should be left that way, not a collector but just a gun that be used to training, or use as spare parts.
That's the one we are talking about?Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Gahimer
Attachment 35676
Yes, the 429 page book released in 1991 and 1993.