No5 MkI legends, truths or bs?

I bought a 1945 BSA No5 MkI recently. Its in excellent shape, aside from a mismatched bolt and stock, but its a perfect shooter.

The seller told me a few stories on it. He said that it was issued in Malaysia and that's why the fore end has varnish on it, and that they often removed the fore end cap and rounded the wood there, like a sporter. Any truth to this?

The fore end looks super dry and has twisted, so if it wasn't done in service I want to strip it and give it a good soaking in RLO before I try to fix the fore end so it doesn't make contact with the side of the barrel. Kind of hoping its just drier than a popcorn fart and has twisted from it. Front band is loose too so I hope things swell up and go back how they should be.

I can post pics tonight.

Thanks

Use raw linseed oil instead, that is the correct stock treatment, after removing any other stock treatment.

FMP (Federal Malaysian Police) stamped on the left side socket would be a strong indicator of Far Eastern service. Lack of the marking does not rule it out either. Britain sent a number to the police during the Malayan Emergency.

Even if it was there is this finish and fore end something that would have been done in service or has someone else had a turn since?

No varnish in service.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you. Pics up shortly

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1590-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1589-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1588-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1587-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1586-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG_1585-1.jpg

Serial on receiver is BF69XX, Stock is G65XX, bolt G67XX. Has proper lightened bolt, Faz rear sight graduated to 800, lightened barrel, electro penciled receiver wall, etc. Could the 'varnish' just be dried cosmo or similar?Maybe dried up flaking off Linseed oil?

looks pretty good, I'd be happy with that... re truth, when they had metal caps on the front of the forend they were prone to corrosion inside and the caps were sometimes removed and the wood rounded Varnish I don't know, could be anything, incl after service or something just done on the day, it doesn't sound official tho.

None of our rifles were ever varnished, ever......... Just try holding a varnished rifle in the rain - of which Malaya in general is well known for. A goodly dose of linseed might help with the warped fore-end but it will not cure it. Dunk the whole thing in very warm to touch oil and let it soak for several hours. Don't think of varnish keeping the weather OUT, think of it as a medium for keeping the wet IN which isn't quite what you want!

When there was any sign of rust or corrosion, and there was inevitably some, believe me...., we would drift out the fore-end cap rivet (I seem to remember that they were brass on the No5... correct me if I'm wrong after all these years) and make good the end of the wood. Then, importantly, glue and plug the rivet hole, make good and then round the end to suit. Then dip fore-end in linseed for several hours. Done hundreds of themPolice, para military Police and Army, from right across the Far East, they all came through the same big UK workshops

Here in Mauserland that would be a good find. London civilian proof marks on the barrel (so no problem with using it as a shooter) but the bayonet boss has been retained (here, nearly all have been removed as part of the "demilitarization" procedure). Barrel bluing looks remarkably good for the age. Hang on a mo - weren't they originally finished with Suncorite? So maybe it was refinished in civilian life.

One addition to what Peter wrote. Dunk in linseed oil for several hours - yes. But if you have not got a handy oil tank, or so much oil, just paint the the oil on inside and out, and leave for days, rather than hours.

If you can, forget it for a week or two. Because even if you have removed any varnish on the surface, the pores of the wood will still be fairly clogged up compared with factory-fresh wood, and the oil penetration is thus reduced. General motto: go slowly with old wood, and repeat the oiling until you are satisfied that it is not taking up any more. It may have taken half a century to dry out and warp - do not expect it to return to its original form in half a day - if ever! And for improved initial wood penetration, add a little natural turpentine to the oil. This also fires up the grain so pleasingly that it encourages you to persevere!

Thank you very much Peter and Patrick. I've been doing the slow application with most of my rifles but have been thinking of building a small oil tub to try Peter's way, this one sounds like a good candidate to me. Can always re-bottle the remaining oil after. How warm is warm Peter? Just trying to think of a way to keep it warm in the tank.

It would appear that someone in the region forgot the good advice/best practices that the REME folks went to the time and trouble to teach them...

However they got that way, a good many No.5s have shown up here in the States varnished (or urethaned...whatever the heck that finish is), including two out of the three I have. There was quite a bit of discussion of the issue on one of the other boards some years back concerning the exact problem Peter mentions...water retention. Several posters mentioned stripping the varnish and finding a layer of spongy, rotten wood underneath the impermeable finish. I was a bit luckier...one of mine was okay, the other didn't seem to be damaged, but is still weeping some sort of machine oil.

Bottom line...if you have a shiny varnish finish, It would likely be a good idea to remove it.

I always remember the linseed tanks being such that you could put your hand in to, say, slosh the wood around or find a 'lost' piece but it would be getting hot. If you were wasting a bit of time by the tanks and dunked some butts in, you could see the air expanding and bubbling out, especiall from the end grain at the ends of the butts or fore-ends. Mind you, that's just where we wanted the oil to impregnate

Flying Pig: I bought two wallpaper wetting troughs at Revy, riveted and glued them together to make a tank long enough for a forend. Cost about $10.00 and I've done 5 forends so far. Two will fit in at a time. Last ones I did two weekends ago and with the tank sitting in the direct sun the oil temp was around 100F after two hours. Obviously, this heating technique won't work after our brief summer in Alberta is over.

Ridolpho

I have it all apart now and have an idea for a temporary tank I'm going to try. The bore cleaned up beautifully. I'll strip it in the next couple days and dunk it. My wife agreed to let me try her electric heating pad, so I may carefully try that for heat. Thanks for all the help

Why not ask Brian at BDL to send it through his phosphating tank. It'll come back like new

That would be awesome but unfortunately I'm in Canada. Were some suncorited and some phosphated then?

Well, yes and yes........ We abandoned the old controlled corrosion method and copied the US better and more durable phosphating. But then, we painted over the phosphate with a hard satin oven baked hard paint called sunkorite. That's all I ever remember being done to our No5's

I wound up redoing the bedding on it and made that fore end work. Wow what a joy to shoot offhand. Peter's stock oiling technique makes a much more enjoyable finish too. Goodbye BLO!

Could be just the lighting, but there's something about that butt that makes me think it was made out of a No4 butt. Can you post a photo or two the of the sling loop area and the relief cut for it?

Gday,cut the toe out of an old woolen sock,soak in linseed and pull over the forend and leave in the sun.works every time.Cheers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Surpmil

Could be just the lighting, but there's something about that butt that makes me think it was made out of a No4 butt. Can you post a photo or two the of the sling loop area and the relief cut for it?

---

Yes if I remember I can take a picture or two tonight after work and post them. After reading Skennerton's about the N05 Mk1 I'm almost positive that it is all as issued. Would someone have taken the time to convert the butt from a No4 propeerly? It is hollowed out properly and is it just me or is it a much chubbier profile than a No4 butt? Also it has the steel plate Skennerton talked about them making obsolete as well.

Fore end is fixed now, I straightened the channel out manually and now all is very well. Shoots like a dream.

For the origins of the No4 butts converted to 5 butts you'll have to read some much earlier threads. We had these issued from Ordnance but I won't repeat myself over and over again

"Fore end is fixed now, I straightened the channel out manually and now all is very well. Shoots like a dream."

How'd you straighten it? I've got one of the last of the CAI import #5's, barrel contacting right side of channel. Assumed it was going to take some steaming back to shape before new BLO application. Is BLO okay?, raw not available here. Thanks, Don

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by eiclan

Gday,cut the toe out of an old woolen sock,soak in linseed and pull over the forend and leave in the sun.works every time.Cheers

---

Ahem! ...(painful ?????)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by drweiler

"Fore end is fixed now, I straightened the channel out manually and now all is very well. Shoots like a dream."

How'd you straighten it? I've got one of the last of the CAI import #5's, barrel contacting right side of channel. Assumed it was going to take some steaming back to shape before new BLO application. Is BLO okay?, raw not available here. Thanks, Don

---

Don, I used a dremmel and roughed it in and then used a dowel wrapped in sandpaper to finish it. Checked with a $5 bill to make sure I had clearance then re oiled. So no straightening to the fore end, just the channel. No one will notice unless they really inspect it and I haven't had to change any parts from how it came to me. Win/win in my eyes.

Thanks Peter, I'll have to do some reading up on that. Pics coming when I get time, house sprung a leak and its going to snow soon!

Your butt will look different to a Faz because the Shirley ones are slightly different in the way the sling area is cut, teh Fax is quite smooth on an angle the BSA has 2 angle steps, why? ask the manufacturers