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Who is the one that can carbines run?...I have 2...One has a aftermarket folder on an inland... and runs everything...Ball and soft points....One is stock...Won't run softpoints....and won't feed ball about 1 time out of 15.... Who to help?.....Who to send it to....?......I won't have won't work 100%...Charlie
I have always used Fulton Armory Fulton Armory | Home
I have worked on lots of Carbines (M-1 and some M-2), and always got the ones I carried as LEO trunk weapons running 100%. What is it doing specifically? Need more data.
Some things to check:
1) Recoil spring should be 10 1/4" or very close,
2) make sure extractor has no chips and spring has sufficient tension and free play
3) make sure ejector moves freely and has sufficient tension
4) make sure trigger housing is not to loose, or magazine too loose in trigger housing
5) chamber an empty case and smartly work action to check ejection -optimum is that it kicks it at least several feet. If it barely clears the receiver, there is an issue.
6) make sure slide moves freely and make sure recoil spring guide is not bent.
7) Make sure magazine springs are oriented correctly: Long side to rear /\/\/\/\/\/\/\ bottom being rear.
8) Make sure gas piston is loose in the retainer and has full range of motion. Check for excessive carbon build up.
It fails to feed...Always on the right side...The soft points deforms and the ball will continue to feed if I bump the operating rod. I have taken the trigger housing and pin from the carbine that works and it still fails to feed....There is sloppiness in the trigger housing/mag fit...The pin also seems sloppy..The hole more than anything may be enlarged....How that could happen, I do not know......I'm going to put this thing in a couple gallons of gas or MEK..if that does not help ,then send it somewhere, ....Charlie
You can try and take the trigger housing off your good carbine and try it on your bad one. If it works OK then you have narrowed down the problem. Are you using factory or reloaded ammo? Check the magazine release for wear and also the nubs on your magazines which might work with one but not so well with the other if slightly worn. If the magazine release is worn replace it with a new type 4. As stated above check the bolt making sure the extractor is clean and free moving and the same with the ejector.
Ran LC 52 I got from DCM Still chokes on the right side....Charlie
---------- Post added at 11:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:04 AM ----------
I have always used Fulton Armory Fulton Armory | Home
Can't see if they run a gunsmith shop....Charlie
How much slop is there in the front pin? Try the front pin from the other carbine. I got one that had a non-standard, undersized pin. If the hole in the receiver has been hogged out, you may need to resort to an oversized pin. Clamp the receiver and trigger guard in a vise and drill the hole to match. This is extreme, but I have seen it done. Also a rear lug being excessively loose can cause a problem. I do suspect it is an issue of trigger guard looseness causing the problem.
Don't burn it. It's worth something, even as a wall hangar. Or for the parts.
I have one I'm frustrated with too, but am working on it. Well, it's sitting in parts right now. Mine's not quite as bad as all that though. It feeds most of the time. But every range session I've gotten a few on up to several malfs.
You got any pics???? :)
Is there any difference in the finish (e.g. "roughness") of the bad gun's feed ramp versus that of the good gun? A toothpick makes a good "feeler" if you can't eyeball it. In order for the soft point to get damaged, it must be hitting or scraping against SOMETHING
One carbine I was trying to diagnose, I removed the action from the stock, took the hammer out (since I did ot haveing dummy proving rounds) and cycled it by hand doing a visual. I tweeked the magazine from one side to the other and back and forth as I cycled to replicate the malfunction. Just a thought.
I have tried all suggested tricks swapping around everything...PUT one can of brake cleaner on the thing...I bought a GI bolt tool so the bolt will come apart and measure the springs...Also measure the operating rod spring...It is smooth with no binding...
I suspect there is a problem with trigger guard fit. the rear lug and front hole sound loose, since you said there is wobble and you thought the front hole was too large. That sounds like the one constant. You need to have the trigger guard housing tight against the bottom of the receiver. It can be done with with peening of the bottom, back corners of the trigger guard lug )raises rear alignment), and the bottom edge of the front hole of the receiver (raises front alignment). You can also "break the bottom corner" of the feed ramp. Between the two, it should do it if trigger guard looseness is the problem.
DO NOT TRY AND TIGHTEN THE LUG ON THE RECEIVER!!!!! It is hardened and it can snap off very easy and then the receiver is most often done and of no value.
I realize that. I was talking about peening the corners of the TRIGGER GUARD, not the receiver. A staking punch can be used to stake the bottom edge of the hole in the front lug, thoughQuote:
Originally Posted by Bruce McAskill
Quote:
Originally Posted by c east
Quote:
Originally Posted by c east
If everything is cleaned and lubed,Quote:
Originally Posted by CrossedCannons
I would be looking over the feed ramp.
Right side needing a close inspection.
Charlie-painter777
I'm still plugging away....Will send more info on findings when I get home this afternoon.....Charlie
Operating rod return spring is exactly 10"
I took out the hammer and Operating rod return spring and put in 30 rd mag of soft points....Holding the barrel tight, I operated the Operating rod VERY briskly and all rounds fed....I'm going to order a new Operating rod spring(from who?) and take the bolt apart for cleaning and try again with the soft points.....Any more Ideas?
Try them: Northridge
Northridge International Inc. / M1 CARBINE PARTS
would this be OK too? Or no?
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=2...-UP-SPRING-KIT
OK, you guys see the links....Which one would you get.....Charlie
Well I know this, don't buy from Fulton. Hehehhe At least the spring. The other stuff might be fine.
Brownell's sells the Wolfe springs which generally are not recommended. They are commercial springs of approximate length, however the recoil spring is extra strength which can also cause problems.
I've ordered springs from orion7 and ozarksurplus. Both sell unused USGI springs.
I was just going to ask about Orion7. They have them for a decent price and I've "heard" good things about them. I'm assuming you would recommend them, eh? Since you posted that.
C EAST and ABPOS I have a thought. There were some 15 rounders marked "NVS" that had the 3rd lug for M2 catch. It really stabilized the 15 rounder. Maybe one of thos magazines and an M2 catch. Worth a try. I may still have one in my mag box. If I do, I will send it to one of you to try, then you can send it to the other one. Let me see if I still have one.
Ugh, my Dad's Carbine doesn't have an M2 catch. Mine does, and I could try it in that one.
So far my list is: two recoil springs, possibly an extractor or two, I might want a hammer spring from my Dad's, although I don't know if it needs it but I might get it anyways. And possibly a bolt tool. I wonder if Orion7 has all that stuff so I can one stop shop.
Orion is not showing a bolt tool. Ozarksurplus has your list and the bolt tool. There are some non USGI bolt tools that are cheaper and work just as well.
Thank you!!! I forgot, I should get some mag springs too. I'll look up that company. I was really wanting Orion7 though. Hmmmmm.....
Wow, crazy. This thread makes me feel better about having the problems I've had. I'm not alone. After googling and hearing other peoples experiences, it has been eye opener. I'm not real sure I like what I see though....
But this Marine Armorer has an interesting statement about the length of a recoil spring. I wonder if he's remembering right. But he's saying if it's under 10-1/2" he would replace it. And a guy on page 5 says he got a 10"er from Fulton. That's annoying.
http://m14forum.com/steel-wood/10660...-carbines.html
The "correct" spring length will depend upon the spring's rate (cf Hooke's Law), i.e. upon wire's material, wire diameter, coil diameter and/or number of coils. If any of these differ from USGI-spec, so will the force required to produce any given deformation. If Fulton's springs may require less preload to exert the same starting force as USGI, then they might reasonably be shorter. I don't know anything about Fulton's springs though.
Great I just got a 10 1/4" from northridge....I can't wait for comments here.....Charlie
Well, this was the first time I've seen that it should be larger than 10-1/4". So... But the man's opinion does carry some weight if he was an armorer. Yet if a lot of peoples carbines are working and their spring is 10-1/4", it's probably nothing to worry about. But all I know is when I tore mine down, it was only 10. It was a long time ago, but I'm pretty sure I ordered it from fulton. And it didn't see so many rounds that it should be worn down. Not to my recollection.
I have always tried to keep a recoil spring that was 10 1/4", but no shorter than 10 1/8". I had a 9 7/8" spring that worked OK on Aguilla (underpowered) ammo, but would not feed from the top of a 30 rounder.. In an AR15, the carbines and M4s are vary dependent on correct recoil springs. I generally get a USGI M4 spring NIW when I can find one for CAR-15 builds.
I'm tearing My Dad's carbine down now and his recoil spring was only 9-3/4". Ugh. Well, at least I know this might be a good reason why it wasn't running well. Now, I think I'll order some this week.