1907 BSACo ShtLE I***

In 92-93 I picked up a bayonet for a .303 Enfield while deployed to Somalia. Several years later I purchased a .303 Enfield. To my dismay I discovered that the weapon had been "sporterized" after doing some research, lesson learned. All the numbers match for the barrel, receiver, and bolt so I guess that's a plus and it is also operational/fireable when assembled. The initial intent was to use the weapon to showcase the bayonet but I don't want to further devalue the rifle. Does anyone know if and who might make a new stock assembly (i.e. buttstock, upper forestock, and lower forestock)? I'm just trying to remain accurate for the period. Any help is greatly appreciated.

Keep an eye out on EBay, Gunbroker, etc..stock sets pop up from time to time. They're getting pretty pricey, especially for No1s..
Also, make sure your barrel hasn't been shortened. That would make things a bit tricky if it has.
As we say on here, pictures are worth a thousand words. It'll make determining what you need a lot easier that way, as LEs have a few parts here and there to make it complete.
Good luck with it, and let's see some pics!

MkI wood is even harder to find. EFD makes new wood, but it's expensive. Well so is original wood. Yes please let's see some piccies.


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Anzac15 and gsimmons,

Right now this is the only pictureAttachment 41652 I've taken but I'll be sure to post many more in the future. Thanks for the interest.

AMS, Sprignfield Sporters carry some of the spares for rebuilding your rifle see Springfield Sporters, Inc.
and the repro front wood and other hard-to-find bits can be found at EFD Rifles - The Enfield Specialists
A UK dealer, Phil Rose, also carries a large range of spares, PM me for his email address.
Rob

The EFD wood looks very good, but there is a considerable amount of fitting required, the inletting for the nose cap is sometimes rotationally out of align and needs work, plus there in no brass re-inforcing wire at the end nearest the butt stock.

If you can overcome the above they can be made to fit, function & look excellent.

I have used several of these fore-end now, just wish they were available for the Long Lee & Cavalry Carbines as well.

AMS: You didn't mention whether your rifle has the original, and quite distinctive, rear sight. If not, there is one posted for sale on e-bay as we speak, complete with the bone buttons (from NZ).

Ridolpho

Anzac15 and gsimmons,

Please find attached several pictures that I've taken. Again thanks for the interest.

Nice rifle there, looks like all the remaining parts are correct 1914 or so. It looks like she has SMLE mkIII forend and rear sight leaf, the sight base is still the original mkI type though. Does the number on the leaf match the barrel? Could be she got mkIII wood and sight leaf in the third '*' upgrade. The forend is defininitely a candidate for a front scarph, I did one on a '03 Springfield recently from two damaged stocks. If she were mine i'd redo her in MkIII wood as I think that configuration was her last military guise and that stock still has the volley sight inletting in it which is quite rare for a cutdown. If you do put her back to MkI * don't bin the stock there'll be someone out there who would use it, pop in the mail to NZ if you like! I restored my 1907 BSA MkI* using wood from EFD and I think its the best you can get however the front handguard doesnt have the correct 'step' before the barrel band and is rounded like a MkIII handguard.
Have fun and we'll see her when shes back together.

I have a spare of the correct front nosecap for that rifle--has very distinctive high, narrowly spaced "ears".

Ed

I see a CR prefix there, looks like one of the rifles issued to the Irish Free State Army.
Looking forward to seeing the end result!

Having collected a few of these Mark 1*** rifles, there sometimes appear to be a pattern: Mark 1*** rifles with the old serial number lined-out and a new serial number with the prefix ER have very little changes performed, they are often still original even with the Mark 1 butt swivel bracket and sometimes the early buttstock.

The Mark 1*** rifles with the old serial number lined-out and a new serial number with the CR prefix often have a modified rear handguard with the backsight protector removed and a Mark 111 backsight protector installed into the Mark 1*** fore-end or else a Mark 111 fore-end is used. The Mark 111 rear sight is often used too, the nose cap almost always is Mark 1.

Please find attached a better picture of the wristband and a few photos of different angles on the rear sight. Am attempting to acquire the various wood stocks through a chap named Geoffrey Organ out of the UK. I've heard he's about the best there is. My plan is to go with the MkI*** style as the current markings and stamps indicate she should be. If my SWAG is correct I should be looking at around $800-$1000 US. I know this post is a bit dated but concerning this rifle if anythings worth doing it's worth doing right. The really nice thing is all the numbers match (i.e. Bolt, Barrel, Receiver) and she still had the original volley sights attached.

I have restored a few and I must say that finding Mark 1*** fore-end wood is very difficult, you might think about adding a piece to the original fore-end.Did you remove the butt plate yet ? the early buttstocks have three holes at the bottom and three at the top or just a single hole and a long hole at the top. You rifle might still have the early correct buttstock.

Finding any Mark 1*** in the USA without the Irish ER or CR (sometimes G) is difficult too. The ConD ll* rifles are also rareAttachment 76034Attachment 76035

AMS.

Given the absolute lack of MK I forends, a modified MKIII forend is the best you are going to do and it is about as correct as you can do for a free state rifle. The free state rifles used MK I forends modified for the MK III rear sight protector and either a modified MK I rear hand guard with the metal removed or a early MK III rear hand guard.

Also all of the CR rifles I have seen that were correct at late MK III rear sight leafs (as your rifle has).

I think you should go for it but as said above the rifle has the correct rear sight and "ears" already. You are lucky to have a lot of good bits there such as the volley sights and early magazine! But you may want to carefully consider spending more than the purchase price of another complete, correct and original SHTLE Mk I*** on an incorrect restoration back to Mk 1*** standards that would always be given away by the CR prefix and the re-serial when it would be a little easier to do an authentic CR series restoration and still have an awesome rifle anyway. Either way a restoration certainly enhances rather than decreases the value of a sporter but whether a "correct" Irish restoration will be worth more sort of depends on how discerning the collectors of the future will be.

If you would like to find out more there is a goodly amount written about the Irish ER, CR, and G series rifles and the interesting history behind them here and on gunboards also.

Also, I hate to say this but I believe the bayonet in the picture (if it is the one you were referencing) is not a Pattern 1907 bayonet for the SMLE but a Pattern 1913 bayonet for the Pattern 1914 rifle or the US Rifle, Model of 1917 as demonstrated by the two grooves in the grips to differentiate it from the P1907 for that very reason and unfortunately will not fit your rifle when you do get the correct MkI nose cap.

As has already been suggested in posts 9 and 14, if this rifle was mine I would retain the existing fore-end and "let in/scarf" additional wood to replace the wood that has been lost. This should be a relatively simple repair job for someone with modest carpentry skills. Not only would this save needless expense but also retain much of the rifle's originality.

If you could post a picture of the bayonet looking at the muzzle ring from the pommel end, please, we should be able to say for sure if it's a 1907 bayonet or not. We can tell this by the muzzle ring being closer to the blade than is the case with the P14 or M1917 bayonets.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flying10uk

If you could post a picture of the bayonet looking at the muzzle ring from the pommel end, please, we should be able to say for sure if it's a 1907 bayonet or not.

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We don't really need closer pics, that bayonet is for a M1917 rifle or P14. It's got a VERY tall crosspiece. That's not 1907. Don't believe me? Wait...

Are you going by the 6th picture along in post 8, Jim, or is there a better quality/closer up picture of the bayonet that I've missed somewhere on this thread? If we are going by this picture, while I would agree that the cross guard may look tall, I would want to see further pictures of the cross guard before saying it's not a 1907.

It looks to me like it has grooves on the grips, rather than the smooth grips of a p'07.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Flying10uk

I would want to see further pictures of the cross guard before saying it's not a 1907.

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It's OK, you'll see. If he ever comes back with a reply...

I don't know if it's just me but the magazine looks extra deep in the pictures in post 8 or is it the way that it's been photographed?

Note transitional mag (as in the post) on the left and a No.4 mag on the Rt no real difference in depth think it is just the way it has been pictured U K.
The modification was done to make use of the mags that were already made that were suited to the MK VI round and not the Mk VII rather than scrap them. I may be incorrect

My ConD 11* 1907 came with the number 2 magazine for the Mark 6 cartridge, barrel is without the HV or SC markings and sights are early toohttps://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../261yzb5-1.jpg

---------- Post added at 09:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:18 AM ----------

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...9/oqhysx-1.jpg

A huge thank you to all who have replied. Your help has been invaluable throughout the process.