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Hi Guys, has anyone out there got the details for making a cutaway SMLE. I don't have an original to work off, but I'd like to make one from some shagged parts I have, more as a skills project on the mill than anything else. Plus I think they look neat and I'd like to have one.
I'd like it to look very similar to an original, I have enough unservicable No4 parts to do one of those too. It might just be a fun little project.
Cheers!
IN the late 70/s early 80's there was a bit of a purge with these skeletonised rifles that were literally littering, well, every MoD unit across the nation. Fron small Army Cadet Forces to large training Battalion armouries. It was decreed form on high that the only genuine/official skeletonised actions were the shortie cut-aways and the remainder were to be culled. Either by withdrawal/return to Ordnance for destruction or rendered '.....incapable of discharging a shot, bullet or other like missile....'
I saw a whole pile (and I mean a BIG pile of 'em....) in the Armoury at XYZ with the Armourer Sgt there to decide what was the best course of action. The shorties went back to the units as did the unofficial but clearly 'incapable' ones too.
So, the only real/genuine/issue ones are the shorties that had their own distinct R&I number, serial number type and VAOS catalogue number. I seem to think that these were B1/CR 88GA and ACTION, skeletonised, rifle, training. Over to you TBone! But the full length ones that show the fit of the barrel in the fore-end do look nice.
I am sure you will be marking it properly as a reproduction. Otherwise future collectors will be confused.
T Bone. There was a dealer a while back advertising to make a cutaway rifle from your rifle for about $350 IIRC. I'll try to find the add, he may have some drawings.
Peter- on the topic of the "shorties" where they all supposed to be to a standard pattern, or did the cut details vary? I have been tempted to buy one a few times, but here the sectioned receiver doesn't prevent it from being a real firearm for the purpose of registration/ licencing, and the cut down barrel makes it a pistol, believe it or not!!!!
Hi partner ... :)
As you know, our site provides full high resolution video conferencing one-to-one between members, as well as a one-way television broadcast function, where one member can share his video with all members who connect.
I have both a No.3 and and a No.4 military done cut-a-ways. I'd be happy to set up a broadcast for you and any other members who wish to join in, to go over these pieces from front to back and answer any questions you want to pose about them.
Let me know what timings would work and I'll post an announcement for everyone about the date, time and subject of the broadcast. :thup:
Regards,
Doug
There WAS a set of drawings for them and the spec was set out in the EMER's too with an IP number (available from REME Insp Branch at Woolwich for the benefit of apprentices and the like making them as trade test examples etc etc). HOWEVER, there were MANY variables including some that I recall that were slotted along the recess in the long lug of the bolt body..... Ouch..... I bet that was hard on the milling cutter when you got to the end of the shoulder! Plus additional recesses and sectioned chambers...... you know the sort of thing
BUT, as I said, the only official ones were the shorties that were issued under the B1 VAOS cat. To be honest, you would never know whether some were officialk, as sectioned by List in the 50's or not. List Engineering from Dagenham were a favoured sub contractor of Enfield who did these and zillions of tired Brens. Usually obsolete Mk1's and knackered Mk2's from the late 40's Mk2 to 2/1 programme.
Maybe that's answered Pauls querie about the 'fakes'. My honest view is that there are so many of these skeletonised shorties around that they'll never (?) become collectable classics so whether a good repop is a fake or not is academic. The EMER just says that the serial number, prefixed SKN, should be visible on the body, bolt and magazine. Mine is engraved on the top sloping surface of the top of the body and another is similar, engraved across the US PROPERTY mark!
No4's were always plentiful for these sorts of projects just so long as they remained accountable. Much later, they used to do DP rifles as machine shop projects and after that the socket section of No4 bayonets. Oh how the craftsmanship of the oldest trade suffered.
Shall I go off at a tangent for a bit........? Armourers are the oldest trade in the Army. Some say waggoners are........ As if......! Anyway, when the REME was formed in 1942 to incorporate the technical side of the Army under one roof so to speak and call them all 'craftsmen', it was decided that to reinforce this fact in Army Council Instructions, that Armourers would always remain 'armourers' as they were in the previous Ordnance Corps. That's why today, technically and officially (but seldom now I hasten to add.....) Armourers are allways prefixed armourer L/Cpl or Corporal or Sergeant and so on. I always made a point of addressing them as such unless it was a more relaxed first names chat - as it usually was with other Armourers
I'd love that. Will PM re timing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger
Peter am I wrong in thinking that SKN numbers only appear on No.4's and never on No.1 cutaways? Have you ever seen a No.1 MkV cutaway? Just asking the question, I can hear the milling machines spooling up. best, p.
You're right........ I NEVER saw anything but a bog standard No1 Mk3 or 3* modified and certainly never an odd-ball Mk5 or 6. Nor did they have the SKN serial numbers now that I think of them. HOWEVER, some that were un-numbered were numbered in the later SA88Axxxxx sequence. Quite why I just don't know unless it was a case of keeping the WOCS books and numbers straight as security was MUCH tightened up in the 70's onwards. But the No4 types..... all marks incidentally were SKN's
Hope this works as a new kornfuzer, but here is one of the nicest cutaways that I have seen.
Dated 1/15, WD marked and done in the UK.
Attachment 42983Attachment 42984Attachment 42985Attachment 42986
I have both a No.1 and No.4 as well and would be more than happy to take any detail photos you may need as well.
You occasionaly see these full length rifles marked with the name of the place. Such as RAOC Sch Hilsea RAOC Boys Training School, Hilsea in Portsmouth where the Apprentices were trained pre-war. Moved due to bombing) or Armrs Wg, Gp (Armourers Training Wing, Gosport) and so on.
We did them at Carlisle, with Sterling SMG's and Bren sub assemblies. They were usually marked and occasionally the good examples were dished out to visiting dignitaries. Mine were usually put into a skip with the others, labelled 'also rans'!
I can help you with a few ideas for jigs if you need
Australian No.1 cutaways have a unique serial number located on the right side of the front trigger guard screw boss located on the receiver. Some are also marked efd indicating work was done at Enfield. All I can say about it for now as I am travelling.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I'm very keen to get Badgers tour of his when that pans out, and it looks like I can get a hands on look too. I'll get the scraps together and post the project here or in the restorers corner depending on what is deemed appropriate.
And Homer I could use any ideas for jigs, my imagination for milling jigs needs some jogging as on the mill I'm pretty green. For what it's worth I was going to use this project to build the jigs for fitting pads for No32's to No4 receivers in the (near) future, and other receiver milling and sight fitting operations. Nothing of value will be damaged... I hope!
It should be a nice one since it's marked "Royal Military Academy", aka "Sandhurst".Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren