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Just pick up a M1 carbine cal. 5.7 Johnson has a Win. receiver. Is there any info on this cal. I look but could not find much. I should get it Monday. Will post pics. It comes with 400 forend .30 carbine brass & dies. . The guy I got it from said There is a feeding problem light primer stricks . I don't think it was ever clean. Thanks for any info & help.
There's lots of info available on this cartridge, the internet should be easy to find it on. Cartridges of the world too. It's a cartridge you don't see much here in Canada though. I think you may have the issue pegged with a dirty rifle, you have enough mags that you can try a different one to see if that's it. They were used by law enforcement more than anything I think.
Congrats! A great little cartridge. In its 50 grain loading it equals a 5.56 from a 11.5" Colt Commando XM177. It is still better than the vaunted 5.7 FN PDW round, with over twice the thump. I would not mind having one some day! If I remember correctly, IAI and Fulton Armory both made carbine for a short time in this cartridge.
Short blurb:
.22 Spitfire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Reloading dies:
5.7mm Johnson | Rifle Reloading Dies | Dies - Reloading
The round was developed by Melvin Johnson and was presented to the military in the early 60's as a way to improve the carbine with just a barrel change. But it was rejected by the military. He then made it available to the public. He would take in your carbine and change the barrel for about $100 which was not cheap back then. He then went on to offer loaded ammo, cases, bullets and even dies for the round. It was never a popular conversion. He also sold barrels so your gunsmith could change it over too. The last one I saw in a gun shop was there for over a year with the dealer dropping the piece every couple of months. He finally used it for trading with another dealer. He had the factory ammo, brass and dies for it but no one wanted it. Later when he was making new carbines he made the 5700 series carbines in .22 Spitfire one of which was a short barrel with sliding stock aimed at police departments. The 5700 series were not big sellers.
You cant find ammo for it. And the forming die is not cheao ether $ 166.00 . I ask a few guys that sell reloading dies at our gunshow here in Canada . The guy almost fell off his chair laughing the other guy also. I guess that told me they did not have any 5.7 dies.
I have one of these. It has a Fulton Armory barrel on a CMP Plainfield receiver. It has had some feeding issues in semi-auto, I think due to different bullet shape/size and incorrect ramp angles. I've used a threaded brass plug to inactivate the semi-auto function, it is now a straight pull bolt action. I have not tried it out yet in its manual configuration. I understand that Melvin Johnson cured the feeding problems with a modified feeding ramp, I think it involved making two smaller ramps, side by side with a little change in the feed angle. I have seen an Iver Johnson receiver with that type of modification, but in .30 Carbine. I also picked up reloading dies, some empty cases and loaded ammo along with a finishing reamer. I would not mind loaning the reamer to a board member who is working on a project.
Chuck
I hate that crap!Quote:
Originally Posted by gunsdora
That just shows ignorance. If you need something you go ahead and get it, then you have it. Form the brass and have a blast shooting it. Then there's no problems.
Had a now deceased friend that had one of the Johnson .22 Spitfire conversions. Ed was a reloader, but never developed a load that would work consistently in the carbine. There was a half dozen of us that went out every Sunday afternoon to shoot everything imaginable, but we never got to see the Spitfire do it's stuff.
Corresponded with Col Johnson's son and he solved the feeding problems for me. I have built several of these carbines with the modified feed ramps. Operate flawlessly! Ammo is 50 gr spire tipped soft point over 13.5gr of VV-133n. Bullet is same weight as M16A1 bullet.
Make sure shell neck and shoulder specs of case are EXACT! Ammo is available if you hunt hard enough. Found 10 boxes of it in Ft Meyers FLA (40gr bullet IAI ammo). However, I prefer to reload. This is a very nice carbine conversion. If MMJ didn't **** everybody off it might have been a contender(see Springfield Armory 1950's light bullet variant). I believe New Haven Arms was started to push this 5.7 wildcat variant. They crashed and burned! Their inventory (IJ receivers and small parts) wound up with the last of IAI's and ALM's in western CT. Some of the stuff still exists today. M1Carbinesinc.com can tell you more.
Comparatively, the 5.7 is a decent little round. WAY better than the FN 5.7! SOme thingw were good ideas at the wrong time. 30 years later it may have flown!
The bullet weight for the USGI M193 round has always been 55 gr. FMJ. The original loading for the .22 Spitfire was a 40 gr. bullet at 2800 fps from the 18 inch carbine barrel. It just did not have enough energy to compete with other rounds.
Bruce you're 100% right. Checked with my gunsmith and we are also using the 55gr. It was easiest to get in bulk. Sorry for the mistake.
rpw, the one thing you might want to check is the rate of twist in your barrel. If it is 1 in 14 or 1 in 16 then your best accuracy will be with a lighter bullet then the 55 gr. I suspect it very well may be the 1 in 14 which was very good for the original 40 gr. bullet. This is a guess on my part but you might want to check to be sure.
Barrels are NOS from iAi production. Twist is said to be 1 in 14. Function testing ongoing. Then velocity and accuracy will follow. It's a shame this variant never took off. It really seems to work extremely well. Bruce, thanks very much for the input. We've made about
2000 rounds of the 55gr for testing. If the gun handles them well then I'll go to the 50gr for the final bullet of choice.
rpw, Let us know how you make out with your testing.
I'd have to question how you considered it a CMP Plainfield receiver. The CMP carbines are returned USGI models, not commercial copies.Quote:
Originally Posted by lambo35
Stickhauler, back in 2006 the CMP received a few hundred M1 carbine receivers from the Army, these included some Plainfield and Universal commercial receivers. I think the commercial ones sold for $50.00 + shipping. The rumor is that these were shipped as complete carbines to some S. American and Asian governments [army, militia, police] through our govt. I do not know who stripped them out, the lend lease nation or the US. They were not USGI issued carbines.
Chuck
Many of those Plainfield carbines were used on government installations by security forces that had the government contract for the location. Owned by the government and when no longer needed given to CMP as surplus.