I let a gas trap get away

This was on an auction last night. I only had the pictures and description to go by and I know that when you are dealing with a rare rifle like this you should probably never buy it without getting to look at it in person so I listened to my inner voice and stopped bidding at $4200. I have the strange feeling it may have been the real thing. If it was, the fellow that bought it for $4300 got quite a deal.

U.S. Springfield M1 Garand semi-auto rifle, .30 cal., 23-1/4 barrel, milit | Proxibid Auctions

Ouch!

Holy Toledo!

It sure looks right. If it's for real it went for about 1/6 what it's worth.

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Originally Posted by cruiserdan

about 1/6 what it's worth.

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That's what I was thinking...there must be something we're missing here.

Little John's had that gun on one of their tables at the Reno gun show a couple of weeks ago. It's obviously not original. A guy at the show told me that the serial number, 1969, was easy to remember. And he remembers a few years ago that the rifle was an M1D.

Och! That'll make you feel better right quickly.

Bob

So, one of those replacement front ends and a few original parts. Just what you want to get hosed for...I could have had a low number or two here but they were completely overhauled. It made me wonder what would the point be?

Jim, They have made non-firing gas trap front ends in Rahway NJ for years without a detailed set of photos it is nothing. Average restorted or correct as they say on CMP gas trap would run around $20,000 to $25,000 and that would be a later serial number. An original gas trap barrel is valued around $10,000 maybe more if early, an original numbered
SA SPG stock is over $3000 if you can find one. The solid buttplates by SA run in the $700 to $900 price range, s/n 1969 when original would have used the very early solid buttplate.
A nice set of springs and follower rod is around $4000 now.
I think $4300 is going to buy you a lot of fake repro parts

I'd just as soon stay clear of anything but shooters for the most part. I've already proven how well(or not) I can identify inspector's cartouches...I have an LL SA that's good but I wouldn't want to take a run at something like a Gas Trap...

Thanks for the info fellas. I'm glad I listened to the little voice in my head for once and really glad that the other guy didn't stop bidding!

Guts, I have never been closer than a computer screen from a gas trap so I would be deathly afraid of buying one even if I held it in my grubby mitts. I wouldn't know real from fake from a lunch break. For the very few who have had the luxury of pawing over one I say you lucky so and so's! Thank goodness we have a few "in the know" fellas here to help out with such things.

The shared knowledge on this forum is outstanding, we have some top notch well educated people here and it's a pleasure to converse with them. I've been on a few other forums that seem to take their pleasure in acting arrogant and trying to just make others look dumb. I have even seen them second guess the finest Garand experts in the world. When I am told something on this forum, I dang sure believe it.

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Originally Posted by RCS

Jim, They have made non-firing gas trap front ends in Rahway NJ for years without a detailed set of photos it is nothing. Average restorted or correct as they say on CMP gas trap would run around $20,000 to $25,000 and that would be a later serial number. An original gas trap barrel is valued around $10,000 maybe more if early, an original numbered
SA SPG stock is over $3000 if you can find one. The solid buttplates by SA run in the $700 to $900 price range, s/n 1969 when original would have used the very early solid buttplate.
A nice set of springs and follower rod is around $4000 now.
I think $4300 is going to buy you a lot of fake repro parts

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Well said.

Consider a restoration that may have a correct receiver, numbered butt plate, rear sight, bolt, internals, op-rod, stock hardware and trigger group. Add to that a Barnett or Ratworx shootable front end with functioning repro springs and that rifle is probably worth more than 4,000 bucks...No?

I'm not suggesting that the rifle that just sold meets those specifications, I'm just thinking out loud.

Sometimes a collector will use fake parts until the original is found - other times they will act dumb when asked if a certain part is original or not especially if the rifle is for sale or on auction. Photos show three items in each photo - only one is original. It can be quite difficult to pick the original part and even more difficult when assembled on the rifle.

You have to be really careful when buying a gas trapAttachment 45424Attachment 45425Attachment 45426Attachment 45427

I don't know about the barrel but I think the handguard in the right (green tint) has the corret ferrule.

The handguards left to right 1, repro, two pieces tig welded in NJ 1993 2. from R. Milton Ohio 1988 and 3 is original from well known collector but may have been refinish. Key to identification is the inside, original is cone shaped inside. Also required is the handguard spacer without front notch.

Barrels, center barrel is original gas trap from 1940, note wear from gas cylinder rear ring. The other two barrels have four inch sleeves over later barrels, very difficult to notice unless you xray them or are very knowledgeable about the rear end differences between gas trap and gas port SA barrels

In the third picture I will guess the left barrel is real. In the last picture I will guess the center barrel is real.

Forth pic you can see the back of the barrel sleeve...

I was watching that auction also. If I remember correctly, the description said that the rifle was built up.

It does say "as built up" in the description, I guess when I read the description it just didn't hit me as to what that meant. I actually think the "up" part didn't register and my mind just saw "as built".

Interesting gas trap period stock (large over small hole in butt) still with a faint drawing number plus a small rack number B-108 next to the drawing number. Also been through inspection as there is a large RA-P on the flat of the pistol grip. Interesting to find something like this

We gotta love the pics of all your old "Stuff" RCS...makes things clear for us.

It sure does, makes it clear and makes me envious.:)

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Originally Posted by GUTS

This was on an auction last night. I only had the pictures and description to go by and I know that when you are dealing with a rare rifle like this you should probably never buy it without getting to look at it in person so I listened to my inner voice and stopped bidding at $4200. I have the strange feeling it may have been the real thing. If it was, the fellow that bought it for $4300 got quite a deal.

U.S. Springfield M1 Garand semi-auto rifle, .30 cal., 23-1/4 barrel, milit | Proxibid Auctions

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Twenty-two years ago that rifle was an M1D.

I know i am a bit late to the party, but i spent about 10 minutes with that rifle at the inspection window for the auction. the rifle was only correct in appearance from the outside.

The internals were not gas trap.

The stock was not a gas trap or even an early stock( no slant cut clip latch
op rod was repro based on condition and freshness of stamping on the top of the op rod
all external marked parts were reparked, such as ferrules, bands, etc.

the barrel was unmarked. i have not seen enough gas trap original parts to know if the front end was repro or original. the front end did look like it has been around for quite awhile. I ended up going home with a garand with gas trap serial, and all NM parts, including bedded and serial marked stock, and a bavarian prison guard M1 carbine