some questions on a new No4mk1*

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I just have a quick question about my new to me No4 Mk1*. It has FTR on the side with a date of 1963. On the receiver it has No4Mk1* but no "US property" markings. All the bits are of different makes, some "C" stamped and some "S" stamped. The butt is SA stamped. The plus side is that the bore is shiney and the barrel and receiver "match". Now the questions, is the serial number original (doesn't look ground down or molested) to the manufacturer? The serial number is 6 digits long. Was this an Indian rebuild (has "ishy screw in place)?
This is intended to be a shooter so I really wasnt worried about the value of matching this and that, I just would like a little more info then I can find on the interwebs.
Thanks in advance,
jesse
If she shoot well enough I might try and make it a fake sniper No4. Also, the first pic is of my No1Mk111* and my k98.

Need bigger pics please?

Based on what you have said,

If the serial number is something like 0Cxxxxx that is correct, C is the initial of the factory where it was made. A square S or S inside a square would be Savage parts so probably original. The bolt serial number should match the receiver for safety sake.

Telling us the serial number would probably revel the year if it isnt stamped on the wrist, unstamped would be later 1943 or 1944.

If its has something like,

"no4 mk 1/3 FTR F xxxxx"

it would probably be an upgrade done in the UK.

If it has just "FTR" and an Isshy screw it was probably indeed FTR'd in india.

Does it have a 2 or 5 groove barrel? The barrel might have a date say F50 or something....thats the year and F is the maker. There is a proof mark as well, that helps say were its from.

If "US property" is missing, I think its not unknown to be ground off by India?

That's my best guess...other's know far more than I, so I might be corrected.

The serial number is a straight 6 numbers with no letters included. The "No4Mk1*" is original when compared to other rifles I've seen. The stamping near the loud end of the barrel is "half struck" in that I can only see the upper half of what was stamped. Trust me, I have looked with a magnifying glass and still can't really make out what the are. There are 2 groves in the barrel and unfortunately the bolt doesn't match the rest of the metal parts. The guy who I got it from did say that he shot it with no problems. I have known him for years and trust what he says.
I will take a closer look at everything when I get home and try and get better pics.

Take the bolt and a whiteboard marker. Clean the bolt lugs with a paper cloth and paint on the marker, close the bolt 2 or 3 times, the whiteboard marker should be scraped off both lugs and there should be a decent sized area on both say at least a 1/4 of the lug area, if its only 1 lug I wouldnt fire it myself.

Will do! Just hope the wife is still up as getting to the gun locker is not a silent endevour.

As far as I am aware if its a mk1* there should be a letter. If its and "L" its Longbranch made, if its a C its Savage made. If its a mk1 It should start with 1 or 2 letters, though a mk1 is possible with L or C, but they are not common.

Serial number reads 60188 and the bolt lugs shows good wear on one side and slight on the other.

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Originally Posted by ssj

As far as I am aware if its a mk1* there should be a letter. If its and "L" its Longbranch made, if its a C its Savage made. If its a mk1 It should start with 1 or 2 letters, though a mk1 is possible with L or C, but they are not common.

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Maltby (iirc) made some No4s stamped as Mk1* but for what reason, is an unknown.

You remember correctly, 5thBatt. Maltby did have a short run of rifles stamped Mk 1*. You don't see those too often, but every now and then one pops up.

I got almost got fooled by that wear just last week. The bolt had had its number falsified, when I checked with whiteboard marker it was one side only.

More experienced ppl need to help with a serial number like "60188" its like no serial number in my books or that I have seen.

---------- Post added at 10:40 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:39 AM ----------

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Originally Posted by 5thBatt

Maltby (iirc) made some No4s stamped as Mk1* but for what reason, is an unknown.

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However they are still numbered starting with a letter? and then a 2?

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Originally Posted by ssj

However they are still numbered starting with a letter? and then a 2?

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Cant really answer that for you ssj, I'm not into the No4 so don't have a great deal of knowledge on them, i only have one as i feel i have too, a 1943 Savage (Stevens :) ) Mk1* & a close relative, a No1 MkVI

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...3no4main-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../mkvione-1.jpg

Could they have restruck it? I really can't see any cross outs. If they did grind the metal down on the receiver is it even safe to shoot?

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https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../mkvione-1.jpg

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:clap::clap::clap:

If you have any worries I'd suggest taking it to a gunsmith. I looked at a mates new toy last night, a very nice 1942 LB, both lugs had a huge contact area and it only went 2/3rds down on the no-go....the barrel was so mirrored it hurt my eyes.....lucky so and so....

Are we sure the she is a MK1 or a MK1*? I live in Waterford and sure would like to see that rifle.

I have to say that I am not tooooooooo happy about this recent forum method of checking bolt locking-up cam bearing with whiteboard marker or indeed any other method than the loooooong time approved method. A couple of pointers first. The matching bearings of the bolt to the body have no consequence to or in any other situation except when the bolt is fully locked down and ready to fire. Whether just one or both or anything else has absolutely no bearing (if you'll excuse the pun.......) in any other position whatsoever.

Sorry to be a tad ruthless but let's nip this pure sxxxx in the bud straight away. Here is how to do it properly and forget all the rest of the crap, please......... That is for amateurs or the so called enthusiastic amateurs who really shouldn't be ......anyway! Bless 'em!

Remove the bolt and bolthead. The bolthead and CHS play no part in this, contrary to what you might read here or elsewhere........ Clean the rear surfaces of the bolt locking cam surfaces and the forward faces of the hardened body locking surfaces with clean methylated spirit. Now put a THIN smear of engineers blue onto the rear surfces of the bolt locking lugs OR the front surfaces of the bolt cams.... BUT NOT THE BOLT AND THE BODY!!!!!!!

Now squeeze the trigger to lower the sear and push the bolt FULLY in so that it overrides the locking cams. Now lower the bolt and you will see that the rear of the lugs are well clear of the locking/bearing surfaces of the body (you won't actually see the left one of course......). Now, while the bolt is still down AND locked, gently draw the bolt rearwards until the shoulders of the lugs meet up with the locking surfaces of the body. Do it slowly again and now push the bolt forwards, lift it up and draw it rearwards.

Only NOW will you see the witness surfaces that were bearing while the bolt was LOCKED in the firing position. This is the ONLY position that counts..........

Now do a couple of dry-runs to test and play before you do it for real. The next thing............ Pull the trash can a bit closer and now lob that bloody whiteboard marker into it!

This is what I have on the rifle. This area looks scrubbed down a bit. If you look in front of the SN you can see an area that has been ground down smooth. I am not terrible concerned about the value of this rifle as it has a 1963 date and FR (my mistake saying it was FTR) stamp on the wrist. Now I'm thinking that everything was ground down nicely and restruck.

Peter thanks, however when out buying there isnt much opportunity to strip. Now Ive used marking blue and yes its the best...and your method is the way...but i find white baord marker similar and easy to transport, unlike a pint of marking blue....

Bolt don't fit correctly, wrong number, bodged/bubba re-number and he won't let you do a simple check like removing the bolthead, then don't buy or if you really must, thenreduce the price. And using ANY form of marker, whiteboard, blackboard, shaving foam or engineers blue (ours is in a grease form and comes in a very small tube) without removing the bolthead WILL NOT PROVE what you're trying to prove or disprove!