Lee Enfield No1 Mk3 - Rear Sight Issue

G'day all,

You all seem quite knowledgeable with Lee Enfields.

I recently purchased a Lithgow No1 Mk3 and I found that the rear sights to not align with the front sights, the rear sight base seems straight. I have ordered a new rear sight leaf to see if its just the leaf that is bent, if that's not issue what can I do next?

The reason I can tell its misaligned is because I have tried shooting the rifle and the rounds are miles from target, I put on a central peep sight and I hit the target on the first round, I can also see through the peep that the leaf is about 2 to 3 mm's misaligned to the left.

Thanks

Ben.

Hi Mace:beerchug:. Welcome aboard. Others with more knowledge will be along soon. I'm interested because I haven't seen or heard of that issue. Any chance of photo's?

Ok, this is the best example I could give.

Trying to get a photo of looking through the peep sight was next to impossible.

The string is running from the peep sight to the front sight, and you can just see the string is about 2 - 3 mm's off. Doesn't seem very far in the picture, but when looking through the peep you can see the blatant misalignment.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...MG_3199s-1.jpg

sorry if the image is to massive,

Thanks.

Backsight bed is/appears to be twisted on the barrel but I bet that it's the foresight if anything.

As for what you do about it...... Well, it's a tricky one but you need to strip it down and investigate further. Maybe first, assuming that your shots using the iron sights are going left, you could bring the foresight over to the left to try to zero it. Can't be any more definate as you ain't told us just HOW far left they're going!

Unfortunately I cant supply any more information at this stage, I will need to head to the range again to record the shots in more detail, but that wont happen for atleast another week, I will make an attempt to try and adjust the foresight at the range. I am hoping it will be just a twisted rear sight and my replacement will fix it.

I do appreciate the replies though, I will do my best to update this post ASAP.

Thanks.

In your pic the sight looks to be in the normal position... but here's a check you can do to make sure....
If you lift the sight leaf you will see a screw that retains the leaf spring. If you can undo that screw you should see there is a slight indent into the barrel where the end of the screw goes. Look to see the threaded hole through the sight base and the shallow hole in the barrel are aligned. If the end of the screw is damaged, it might mean somebody has used a tool on the sight base to attempt unscrewing the barrel. (there is also a cross pin through the top of the barrel, but I have seen these bent and sheared off before too.)

As Peter has suggested, much more likely your front sight blade needs drifting over to correct your sighting. Have a look at the base and go from there.

If your aperture sight is accurate on the rifle, (windage set at zero) just means the scale on the windage arm has been set to suit the position of the front sight.
Moving your front sight to shoot on with the issue sights just means you may have to move the scale on the windage arm once you find the new zero with the aperture sight.

Thanks, I will take note and go over the rifle. Will fire a few rounds with front and rear sights, then try it with the peep, and go from there.

Having read and agree with fellow Armourer Son, what about removing the handguards (simple) and physically trying to rotate the rearsight bed and foresight block band to test for firmness on the barrel.

All OK? Right, now boresight the bore on a distant aiming point (the DAP) and use your eye to see where the sights are pointing. This is called collimating. This is better than shooting because the line of sight doesn't deviate with wind or gravity. This will very probably give you a definitive answer as you will physically SEE what is at error/fault. Mind you, it's not uncommon to find the foresight blocks of rifles canted over very slightly especially on No4's and L1A1's (and on L85/SA80's I have to add......). That's why in the real world as opposed to the fairy-dust world of the factories and training schools we would breech up using a surface plate or sheet of glass. But that's another story

Looking at the photo it appears that the line is not central to the rifle supporting what has been said about the front blade needing adjustment. The rear sight appears to be pretty central to the wood. Isn't it 'normal' for the front sight to be set over to one side? It's been said that the SMLE 'throws' the boolit to the left (or is it the right?) so the foresight gets compensated. (I don't have any full furniture rifles so I can't check).

Are you saying the front sight is not in the same rotational plane as the rear? Meaning you'd like to screw in a bit more? (Can't, of course)

We're not saying anything beyond a few ideas so that YOU can identify and then tell us what the actual problem is. Only then will WE be able to tell YOU what to to fix it

A photo of the front sight similar to the photo of the rear might clear things up a bit. It's not unusual to see the front blade offset to the left some.

Don't worry, I fully intend to fix this issue myself but with some fully appreciated advice. I will get you some more information about my issue when I can. Sucks living in the city, never enough time to head to my mates farm to fire a few rounds.

I am still hoping to get out there this weekend and try everything that people have recommended.

The "Block, Band, Fore-Sight", (Post), is OFFSET from the bore axis by 0.015" (fifteen thou) to the LEFT. That's 0.015 "Pratt and Whitney" inches, by the way. Note that the "ears" on the nose cap are ALSO offset the same amount to the left!

I understand that this was to compensate for all the weird stuff that goes on whist the bullet is winding its way through the barrel AND as it travels through the atmosphere. Given the sight radius of a SMLE, fifteen thou. is a reasonable offset for a target at 400 yards. Just a hint, when "bore-sighting", try aiming out a window at distant street-lamps at night; it cuts down the "clutter" in internal reflections in the rifling. And be prepared to do "adjustments in the field".

That aside, is your rifle a recycled "range rifle" with a Lithgow heavy barrel in it? If so, the "standard" rear sight bed will have been "retro-fitted" somewhere other than the factory. (Unless you have one of the fairly rare factory set-up "H" barrel rifles.) Not only that, but unless the barrel has been CORRECTLY indexed (dead square) to the receiver / body, the front sight will be canted from the start. Start with checking the alignment of the barrel FIRST.

If the tapered hole for the barrel has not been reamed out PERFECTLY on the original centreline, the base will be "wonky" in some direction or other and thus may be skewed by a significant amount, like ten to twenty thousandths of an inch at one end).

If whoever put it on there was not quite up to speed, it could also be canted a degree or two around the bore-line, just to add to the misery.

All is not lost, however. Alan at Kingaroy Firearms in Queensland has the set-up to open out the bases correctly for the heavy barrel.

Has the nosecap also been "relieved" (butchered), by the opening out of the barrel hole with a rat-tailed file in the hands of a "non-tradesman"?

Final caveat: ALL of the offsets and fiddling are predicated by the use of MK 7 BALL!! S&B or Winchester hunting ammo WILL produce different results.