Does this inglis wood holster look legit?

This rig is part of a gun/holster combo and I want to make sure it is real before closing the deal. The seller is a military small arms collectible seller and is letting me pay via cc and he will let me inspect for 3 days. The wood grain looks suspect and it has the common replica stamps "made in canada" and "1945 SA LTD". He says it fits tight and it has the white foam at the bottom. The stain mismatch is throwing me off but the overall finish looks weather worn like it should. Any comments?

JonAttachment 47234Attachment 47235Attachment 47236Attachment 47237Attachment 47238

Have a look at this thread, it appears the copies are so good that its hard to know the real from the fake unless you know what to look for.

Inglis Hi Power shoulder stock. Real, or memorex?

I read that post and I am still unsure at the moment. I was hoping for a definite opinion to remove some doubt.

Jon

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Originally Posted by kretzj

I read that post and I am still unsure at the moment. I was hoping for a definite opinion to remove some doubt.

Jon

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Like you, I'm non the wiser. All the identified copies are so good I couldn't tell either way.

I think it's legit, here's why. The finish of the wood and metal has a deep aged patina to it, very hard to duplicate. The most telling thing is the tight grain of the wood,,Walnut? It appears to be old growth. If it isn't legit somebody is going to very great lengths.. My 2cs

This is my concern. Compare this replica to the one I posted. UniqueCanes - Browning Hi Power Wood Stock The grain is similar and the number 9 is the same. Compare the 9's to the attached known real holster.

Jon

/Users/kretzj/Desktop/holster.jpg

see picture.Attachment 47260

I'm sorry but the wood isn't even close. The repo has a crappy stain job and the "Made in Canada" is too small.

Yours has the "Look" to me. In your second picture at the point under the 45' stamp see those bumps? That's the old cured finish whatever they used, being pushed out of the pores, that takes years of humid/dry humid/dry,,again VERY hard to duplicate.

Edit> What kind of money for this are we talking about?

Warpig,

Are you saying my original pictures at the top look real? What throws me off is that most of pictures I see of the holsters seem to have a lighter look which I posted on the my last posting. Also the number 9 is different between the holster I posted first and the last picture I posted. The gun and holster are $1400.

Jon

Also, take a look at this holster. Take a look at the different colored wood insert at the hinge. Do all the "real" holsters have this insert for strength? The replicas do not have this detail as well as the one I posted.

JonAttachment 47264

Is the material to protect the end of the gun foam or a white fabric material?

Jon

There shouldn't be a stamp "Made in Canada". I've seen lots back before they were worth serious money. Those still reside in collections, I'm pretty sure it's a copy. We have examples here in this forum member's collections too... Don't be paying more than the price of the pistol.

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Originally Posted by kretzj

Also, take a look at this holster. Take a look at the different colored wood insert at the hinge. Do all the "real" holsters have this insert for strength? The replicas do not have this detail as well as the one I posted.

JonAttachment 47264

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Yes, the one your interested in looks legit from a materials and finish point of view.
The wood insert is a biscuit, used to reinforce against cracks. Nobody making a knock off is going to go through the trouble of milling the cut for a biscuit IMO.

$1400?? I don't blame ya for wanting to be sure,,,,

The real ones don't have "Made in Canada" stamped on them.

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

There shouldn't be a stamp "Made in Canada". I've seen lots back before they were worth serious money. Those still reside in collections, I'm pretty sure it's a copy. We have examples here in this forum member's collections too... Don't be paying more than the price of the pistol.

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If it isn't real I would've got robbed..:(

LoL,, while I was typing you replied which I didn't see until I replied.

There we have it "Made in Canada" stamp = FAKE
I will say whoever is making these takes pride in his work..

At the Calgary Gun Show a couple years back, there were a number of Chinese nationals going around spending serious money on various collectables(mostly Nazi) and we expect they were going back to Mainland China for re-production...watch and shoot on this...

Problem with this little stamp we're talking about is...in a few years there'll be scads around and people will believe they're the goods...

I appreciate all the inputs! The concensus from my web research is that the "made in canada" stamp was required when they were imported into the states. This is an import mark and would definately affect the collectability of an original holster.

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Originally Posted by kretzj

"made in canada" stamp was required when they were imported

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Interesting...first I've ever heard of it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kretzj

I appreciate all the inputs! The concensus from my web research is that the "made in canada" stamp was required when they were imported into the states. This is an import mark and would definately affect the collectability of an original holster.

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Maybe I'm being stupid here but wouldn't they (Government body) want to see a genuine country of manufacture i.e. China for the fakes and not Canada where the Chinese would like you to believe there from. Or are you saying the originals imported need to have 'Made in Canada' marked on them?

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Originally Posted by Brit plumber

the originals imported need to have 'Made in Canada' marked on them?

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Sorry, that's still a story I just don't believe. Why would it have never surfaced until this thread? If you look at the known copies, they have that marking...

It doesn't make sense to me either.

If I'm wrong, that's fine. The thing is, there's a bag of guys here that can tell us definitely about this so called "Import mark". Why would it be something that's not surfaced before. If they've been imported, it would benefit the importer to start such a story...?

one for comparison , i got this one before i ever heard of "fakes" being made -


https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...e019a2d8-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...a1789d45-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...b8c1e79f-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...e6e92e96-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...719b3934-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...e5243d30-1.jpg

And...no made in Canada stamp.

And Original stock/holsters were marked "made in Canada" If they were imported (according to US law on Imports) into USA.

I've seen imported stock/holsters marked that way (Original as well).

Check "Inglis Diamond" by Clive Law.......

DJ

The 'made in Canada' stamp is fine. This is a feature of some originals. I talked to Clive Law about this subject before when I was looking at a similar stock.

In my opinion, the OP's holster is original and I have no concerns.

-Steve

Yep, I just looked at mine and there are a couple of originals with the Made in Canada stamp present.

The original stocks from WW2 are not marked Made in Canada. The vast majority of then were bring backs from during the war or brought in just after the war was over as surplus from Canada. There was no requirements of markings back then. The ones found now marked Made in Canada are less then 20 years old and were made in Canada and imported into the country. When they came in BATF warned people that they were not original stocks and could not be put on a high power. In fact it was illegal to have a high power that could take a stock and the reproduction stock in the same home. An original was OK but not the repo. I will say the repo stocks are very well made and excellent quality.

So troops...do you now see where I am with this?

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Originally Posted by Bruce McAskill

The original stocks from WW2 are not marked Made in Canada. The vast majority of then were bring backs from during the war or brought in just after the war was over as surplus from Canada. There was no requirements of markings back then. The ones found now marked Made in Canada are less then 20 years old and were made in Canada and imported into the country. When they came in BATF warned people that they were not original stocks and could not be put on a high power. In fact it was illegal to have a high power that could take a stock and the reproduction stock in the same home. An original was OK but not the repo. I will say the repo stocks are very well made and excellent quality.

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Hi Bruce,

Can you please explain to us the source of your information?

Many original Inglis stocks exist marked 'Made in Canada'.

This is also stated as an original feature on some Inglis Stocks in Clive Laws book 'Inglis Diamond' under the chapter that discusses this item. I have also talked to Clive about this topic before.

To base the originality of the holster solely on this marking is not fair.

Regards,
-Steve

The US law passed in the 1890's required all imported products most have the country of origin placed on them. Vet bring backs would not be so stamped of course. I don't know but I wouldn't think an imported holster made either before or after WWII war would be any different then any other imported product that's imported into the US via a manufacturer, company, or licensed dealer/distributer. Having said that, I don't know how the fakes made in other countries get to come in without the county stamp. Maybe circumventing the stamp by being mailed to the US via individual purchases from foreign dealers. Ray

I'm with Steve1987. I've collected Canadian Hi Powers and accessories for many years. I also imported quite a few of the stocks from collections in Canada in the 90's and up until the mid 2000's plus have purchased them here and there at shows in the USA for 30 years. Many originals are marked "Made in Canada" as are P'37 web gear and other military items imported since the end of WWII. I think the US marking requirement for country of origin came into play in the 1930's but could be earlier as mentioned above. I've never seen a reproduction that was made of walnut or made in Canada for that matter. All real Canadian produced stocks are walnut. I will say that the Chinese copies are very good and even the markings are there but they ain't walnut!

Just looked it up, 1930, could of sworn it was earlier but now I remember that's how I could tell if a item was older or newer then 1930 by the stamp. Ray
Country of Origin Marking Guide

I'd make an uneducated guess that the Chinese bought an original that was imported to the USA with the "Made in Canada" stamp so they duplicated it, (the stamp), too. Crafty little devils! I saw tons of them on Sarco's tables at the Knob Creek show years ago when they were plentiful. As I said before; very nice, (and cheap), but NOT walnut.

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Originally Posted by Brian Dick

...snip.... I will say that the Chinese copies are very good and even the markings are there but they ain't walnut!

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Luckily the Chinese didn't copy the military inspector markings, that's what I look for.

I bought my first real Inglis stock and my first repro Inglis stock from the same guy at a Great Falls gunshow.

The current repro stocks, the hinge screws are a different thread and the iron is not the same size either.

LE has the key. The originals all have the little oval inspector's mark on the top of the stock just ahead of the "hump". I've never seen a Chinese stock with it present. I think the fakes have blued metal too instead of the excellent Canadian manganese phosphate finish applied.

I have a couple of originals missing the mounting metal hardware. Do any of you guys have any spare metal lying about? I've heard the stories about CAL employees taking home and burning these in their fireplaces post WWII. There must be some spare metal out there somewhere.

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Originally Posted by Brian Dick

burning these

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I was told they used them for firewood at the factory...

I'm sure the story is embellished by whoever is telling it at the time. They're probably both true for all we know!

I wish I could get my hands on some of the mounting hardware. I reckon I can pull a set and get a few sets made by hand but it won't be cheap. I think I have two original stocks missing it altogether and one that some numb nuts modified to fit another pistol of some sort.

Steve, I have owned three of these stocks over the years and not one of them had Made In Canada on it. The ones made in China were not nearly as good as the originals or the newer reproductions. But ATF stated the ones from China were not legal to have with a high power and the same was written by ATF when the reproductions came into the country. ATF was the one who stated that ANY stock with Made in Canada was considered to be a reproduction and only the originals without any made in Canada were allowed to be with an Inglis High Power.

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Originally Posted by Bruce McAskill

ANY stock with Made in Canada was considered to be a reproduction

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Interesting, first time I've heard that...very interesting.

I just went and looked at mine again. There are two marked "Made in Canada" that also sport the military proof mark. They are obvious originals. I have four more that are original less the "Made in Canada" mark. I also have one of the nice quality reproductions marked "Made in Canada" but there's no Canadian military proof and it isn't walnut. It's too nice to be a Chinese repro so it's probably one of the one's mentioned by Bruce. I'm with BAR, "interesting". I'm not surprised by ATF's ruling but it isn't correct. There are originals with the "Made in Canada" stamp present.