Some recent bayonets

Some are very recent, some I've had a few months, one I've had over 20 years.

Can you ID them? I know what they are, just a little game to play.

Which one have I had for over 20 years?

All but two are of WWI vintage, ID the two that are not.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...bf937e17-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...b69768a6-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...fb39af6d-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...5875be2f-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0ae25167-1.jpg

A Hakim bayonet and a Belgian M 1924? Now I look at the second one the butt is wrong for that one...

The Hakim is one. No Belgian bayonets in this grouping. I had thought about putting one in but figured I had already posted photos of that one a long time ago.

Three bayonets were produced by one country. However, one was made for export and it could be said that a second one was not produced by the same country technically due to the time it was produced. In other words, at the time it was produced, this country was broken down into a loose confederation of states and this second bayonet is marked as one of those states.

All other bayonets belong to a different nation.

THe Finnish "Fiskars" is 1920's so post WWI

Yes, the Finnish Fiskars is the second post WWI bayonet. On that one Carl, can you positively identify it. It was claimed to be an M27 but I'm thinking it might be an M35. I've studied the different types and I can't see much of a difference.

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Originally Posted by Aragorn243

No Belgian bayonets in this grouping

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I knew almost immediately I was wrong on that...the pommel was wrong. The top pic, fourth from the top right...looks like an 1888 blade but isn't, what is it?

Finnish Bayonets

Good information above, painstaking research and excellent color photographs.

I am particulary envious of the Finnish & German blades. Need both but alas frugality has intervined. Very nice group. Thanks for the inspirational photos as I know you don't tend to pay retail perhaps there is hope for me finding a bargin as well.

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Originally Posted by gew8805

Finnish Bayonets

Good information above, painstaking research and excellent color photographs.

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That's where I tried to figure out what mine is without any success. They are so close in appearance to me. Someone with more experience perhaps can point out the subtle differences.

---------- Post added at 03:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:14 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by HOOKED ON HISTORY

I am particulary envious of the Finnish & German blades. Need both but alas frugality has intervined. Very nice group. Thanks for the inspirational photos as I know you don't tend to pay retail perhaps there is hope for me finding a bargin as well.

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I spent more than I usually do. It was not top dollar, it was not quite the usual price but they weren't much lower. Sometimes I get in a mood where I turn into a compulsive buyer. I've been in one of those moods lately.

---------- Post added at 03:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:16 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

I knew almost immediately I was wrong on that...the pommel was wrong. The top pic, fourth from the top right...looks like an 1888 blade but isn't, what is it?

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Still trying to make a bit of a game out of it. When you said Belgian, you were close geographically. These also would have carried through into WWII by the nation that used them.

Since it appears the "game" is a bust, thought some of you guys would like to try it, I'll ID the bayonets.

Left row of two are the two post World War I bayonets. The top is an Egyptian Hakim, the bottom is an M27 series Finnish bayonet. Which one it is exactly I am not sure.

Right row top to bottom: Austrian M1895 cavalry with the adjustable sight, German S98/05 Butcher, Swedish 1914 Cavalry Carbine, Dutch 1895 Mannlicher, Turkish 1890, British 1907 (this is the one I've had for over 20 years), German S98 (Bavarian), and French M1886 Lebel.

The most expensive was the Finn at $180 and the least expensive was the British 1907 at $20. I wish I had bought a lot more of the 1907's. But to be fair, I was young, recently married, recently out of college, new baby on the way and $20 was a lot of money back then. I had bought the No SMLE MK III at Woolworths for something like $79 and found the bayonet to go with it a few weeks later at a flea market or show of some type. This was my first surplus rifle and first bayonet and with one exception, the last of both for nearly 20 years.

My personal bayonet collection want list is down to three. A Canadian Ross, a US M4 and a Polish Mauser. Does not mean I have them all by any means but I'm concentrating on WWI and WWII and not all that concerned about variations of type. I do have a few duplicates of type with different variations as I have at least one for every rifle I own. My collection is pretty modest at roughly 100 or so. Most are in well used condition and only two can be considered very rare, the 1950's reworked British cruiciform of which only a dozen or so are known to exist and a Belgian contract Chinese Mauser bayonet, photos of both should be on here somewhere.

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Originally Posted by Aragorn243

the 1950's reworked British cruiciform of which only a dozen or so are known to exist

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I don't follow...what makes it only one of a dozen or so?

little hint, try Holland:thup:

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Originally Posted by Aragorn243

1950's reworked British cruiciform

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Sorry Carl, I looked at your site but didn't see it. We ARE talking about a #4 cruciform? RE-worked...? Or is that the proper name for this one... Attachment 47363

We went all over the reworked cruciform last year. It has been verified by Graham who said to his knowledge only a dozen or so are known to exist including mine. When he wrote his book, only seven were known to exist. So more are turning up but they are still pretty rare.

Carl is referring you to his "Holland" listing on his website to id the Dutch bayonet.

Yes, I went there and the blade I pictured is the only one I could come up with. The others are all known to me. Do you have a pic of this blade you speak about? Do you mean the Beaumont bayonet?

Carl doesn't have one pictured.

Try looking up M1895 Dutch Hembrug Artillery Carbine Bayonet images. You'll see them with scabbard which I do not have. Hembrug is the manufacturer.

I don't have a Beaumont bayonet. Earlier than I'm really interested in.

Thanks, now I have it. Haye's Otupaluk has one and want's decent money for it, states scarce...here it is...

Attachment 47403

I don't think it is the bayonet that makes it scarce but the scabbard. Numerous bayonets, not cheap but available. Bayonets with scabbards very expensive. I unfortunately can not afford a scabbard.

Aragorn 243, I am confused, are you talking about the No4, MkI? Like usual, I must be missing something...... :banghead:

Talking about two bayonets I think. One the Dutch bayonet, the other the No4 MKI rework. Found one at a flea market a while back and investigated it as it actually is marked No4 MKI CLEARLY. No Singer marking. The experts weighed in and determined it was one of a handful of known examples of a 1950's Singer rework which the original markings were scrubbed and new ones applied. So it is an actual original Singer No4 MKI that for some unknown reason was reworked, basically cleaned up and re-marked. The thread is still here on the boards. When Graham wrote his book he said there were 7 known examples but as his book is several years old, a few more surfaced since then. He told me in communications that he was then aware of maybe 17 or so.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aragorn243

Found one at a flea market a while back and investigated it as it actually is marked No4 MKI CLEARLY. No Singer marking. The experts weighed in and determined it was one of a handful of known examples of a 1950's Singer rework which the original markings were scrubbed and new ones applied. So it is an actual original Singer No4 MKI that for some unknown reason was reworked, basically cleaned up and re-marked. The thread is still here on the boards. When Graham wrote his book he said there were 7 known examples but as his book is several years old, a few more surfaced since then. He told me in communications that he was then aware of maybe 17 or so.

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That's the bayonet I've been pulling teeth asking about. That's the detail 've been trying to get. I thought you meant a #4 bayonet...

Glad we could get it straightened out.

Now, which of you fellows can tell me what model of Finnish bayonet I have? It was sold as an M27 but I'm thinking it is probably one of the later ones. I cannot tell the difference as they all look pretty much the same to me other than the blade shape on some of the very early ones.

Ah. I think I see now, thanks. Can you give me a page number for reference? I have been looking but can't seem to find it.....

If it's confusing you GEW and BAR, it's confused me for ages! Having due regard to the standing of Graham (Priest) and Aaragorn (who spent ages explaining all this to me), what I can't seem to get my head around, knowing a bit about the Army system (although not about the 50's system in particular of course) is that this must be the only time that the UK Military set about a refrbishment programme for something/bit of kit that had already been declared obsolescent about 6 years previous. According to the 1944 No4 parts list although I could never find the obsolescent date in the LoC's, the parts list info was usually sufficient authority for us Armourers in the QM's department!

Peter, sometimes it seems that confusion makes life worth living, doesn't it?

At least I think so......... *sigh*

(Yet another No.4 bayonet variation to look for!) :cheers:

Here's the thread:

Fake British No4 MK1 cruciform Bayonet?

That's the bayonet I was asking about. Thank you for the pics and finally showing me what we're talking about. Now I have something else obscure to keep my eyes peeled for.